"Hans Franke" - "Symphony No. 17 in G minor, "À la Russie", Op. 834 (1962)"

[Reverie]

Funnily enough when I was looking at this after you first sent it me I thought there were footprints of Tchaikovsky? I didn't dare say it but I still think it after re-listening.

[John Boyer]

I don't hear the Tchaikovsky references, though I know Op. 75/79 quite well and Op. 36 as well as the next person.

Could this be a copy not of a symphony but of a concert suite?  Any late 19th to early 20th century Russian suites in G-minor out there?

[Vitaly]

• Yuliya Veysberg / Julia Weissberg, also Rimskaya-Korsakova (1878/80–1942) Symphony, Op. 4 1908–1910. Haven't seen the score, but the composition, bar and page sizes make this quite unlikely.

Dear Ilja, could you please elaborate on this passage? How did you get about it? What are your sources?[/list]

[Ilja]

• Yuliya Veysberg / Julia Weissberg, also Rimskaya-Korsakova (1878/80–1942) Symphony, Op. 4 1908–1910. Haven't seen the score, but the composition, bar and page sizes make this quite unlikely.

Dear Ilja, could you please elaborate on this passage? How did you get about it? What are your sources?[/list]

Yulia Lazarevna Vaisberg. Symphony in G minor, Op. 4. For large orchestra.

Movement 1: Allegro moderato. Full score, 84 pages.
Movement 2: Allegro grazioso; 2/4; C major. Full score, 83 pages.
Movement 3: Andante. Full score, 44 pages.
Movement 4: Moderato. Full score, 72 pages.

Compare that with the figures for the Franke version of the '17th Symphony': 29–15–16–37 pages – and unfortunately, it looks rather less than convincing. Perhaps not impossible, but not very plausible either.

Could this be a copy not of a symphony but of a concert suite?  Any late 19th to early 20th century Russian suites in G-minor out there?

There are a couple, but far fewer than there are symphonies in that key. It's not Arensky's, Moszkowski's or Akimenko's, I've been able to verify that as well. I've not been able to find others.

[Vitaly]

May have found one more Gm symphony
https://nvuc.ru/images/2019/nvuk_2019_17.pdf
page 60, left column, last paragraph
Source: Kritik: Konzert // Die Musik. Jhrg. 7. Heft 21. Berlin, 1907–1908. S. 182–195
Composer: https://imslp.org/wiki/Category:Sakhnovsky,_Yury

[Vitaly]

Cross-reference
https://lib.sptl.spb.ru/ru/nodes/24302-russkaya-muzykalnaya-gazeta-1907-locale-nil-15#mode/inspect/page/13/zoom/6
Right column, second paragraph - 2nd symphony planned for 1907-1908

[Vitaly]

Here we go

https://lib.sptl.spb.ru/ru/nodes/24344-russkaya-muzykalnaya-gazeta-1908-locale-nil-18-19#mode/inspect/page/10/zoom/7

G-moll. Eclectic, Scherzo in Fugue form, Finale in tempo di marciale

[cypressdome]

Does anyone know anything about the Symphony in G minor by Josef (or Joseph) Hüttel (1893-1951)?  Apparently, composed in 1935 it won a prize from the Smetana Jubilee Foundation and was published by 1939 (see Hofmeister 1939). Hüttel was a composition student in Prague of V. Novak and in Moscow of Taneyev. He remained in Russia until around 1920 and ultimately settled in Egypt where he was conductor of the Alexandria Philharmonic and then a director with the state radio.  He returned to Czechoslovakia after WW II.

My search through the Hofmeister publications up through 1940 was mostly a dead end: Kletzki's Second Symphony (choral finale), Bergh's Tragische Sinfonie (on IMSLP), Hermann Ambrosius' Suite in G minor for Orchestra (6 Baroque dance movements), Paul Richter's Third Symphony (on Youtube), and Hüttel's symphony.

[Ilja]

Here we go

https://lib.sptl.spb.ru/ru/nodes/24344-russkaya-muzykalnaya-gazeta-1908-locale-nil-18-19#mode/inspect/page/10/zoom/7

G-moll. Eclectic, Scherzo in Fugue form, Finale in tempo di marciale

Thank you! The whole relevant part:

Yuri Sakhnovsky's Symphony in G minor occupies a position midway between compositions characterised by excessive enthusiasm for one tendency or another. It is written in an eclectic manner and evidently belongs to the composer's early works; nevertheless, it is a pleasure to hear. What chiefly wins us over is the sincerity of Sakhnovsky's creative impulse and the originality of his conception. His scherzo takes the form of a playful fugue, while the final movement concludes with a broad, funeral-march-like tempo di marciale.

Doesn't really seem to fit the bill, though.

[Ilja]

Does anyone know anything about the Symphony in G minor by Josef (or Joseph) Hüttel (1893-1951)?  Apparently, composed in 1935 it won a prize from the Smetana Jubilee Foundation and was published by 1939 (see Hofmeister 1939). Hüttel was a composition student in Prague of V. Novak and in Moscow of Taneyev. He remained in Russia until around 1920 and ultimately settled in Egypt where he was conductor of the Alexandria Philharmonic and then a director with the state radio.  He returned to Czechoslovakia after WW II.

The Hüttel is fascinating. Apparently, the score was in the possession of Bohuslav Leopold even after WW2, and available for hire. That might make it accessible to Franke. On the other hand, would such a Russian-sounding thing win a Smetana Jubilee Foundation Prize? Still, worth a follow-up.

[Vitaly]

Doesn't really seem to fit the bill, though.

Well, is his Scherzo a fugue? May be not. May it sound as something like playful fugue? It may, for someone incompetent like me. Is his Finale sound like tempo di marciale? Same thing, and even more so at certain parts.

Nevertheless, after fourth or firth listening I was quite confident that this is a Moscow school and the author was born before 1870. That how I stumbled upon or, better say, remembered this guy. I can imagine him composing a symphony like this shortly after Tchaikovsky death or in 1904 for 10th anniversary.

Anyway, I know where manuscripts of BOTH his symphonies are (https://music-museum.ru/). And I have written them asking to confirm key and parts, and when confirmed I gonna bit a hell out of them to obtain copies, at least first pages of each part.

[Ilja]

I'm not discounting it, Vitaly, it's definitely a candidate, and we should also not overly trust what reads like a rather casual review. If you can somehow obtain even a few score pages, that would be a huge help. 

Then again, there is the question where Franke could have gained access to a Russian hand-written score from West Germany in the 1960s. But if this IS the same work, we may go from Nazi shenanigans to Cold War cahoots. 

[Vitaly]

it's definitely a candidate

Not anymore (
https://music-museum-iss.kamiscloud.ru/entity/OBJECT?query=%D0%A1%D0%B0%D1%85%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9%20%D0%AE%D1%80%D0%B8%D0%B9%20%D0%A1%D0%B8%D0%BC%D1%84%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F%20g-moll

[Ilja]

Pity. Ah well, thanks so much for checking anyhow.