Grimm Symphony/Suite in Kanonform (cpo)

[Alan Howe]

The finale has really grown on me over the past few weeks of repeated listening. In any case, many fine symphonies in the 19thC are constructed in similar fashion, e.g. Bruckner 7, Brahms 2, etc.

[Ilja]

It's not just a matter of length, though, but also of two movements that share a similar tempo and a (almost) consistent forward drive. Brahms' 2nd has a much more pastoral scherzo which is very different from the finale; same for Bruckner 7, where the variation within the movements is greater too (and which is altogether a very different beast).

[John Boyer]

Agreed.  It took a moment for me to realize the finale had even begun.  It's as if it were the second half of one long movement, separated only by a double bar.

[Alan Howe]

My reaction was quite different: there's a very obvious minor key ending to the Scherzo which forms a clear contrast with the bright major key start to the finale. I had also been familiar with Reverie's computer realisation, so there was no surprise when I first heard the new recording.
   I mentioned Bruckner 7 and Brahms 2 because they are front-loaded as far as their first two movements are concerned, as is Grimm's Symphony. I've never confused the last two movements of the latter.
   FWIW I had been interested in Grimm's Symphony for years (I have a copy of the score). While Chris Fifield was researching symphonies for his book, I supplied him with copies of recordings and we discussed at some length the candidates for the period post Schumann 4, including the Grimm whose background was (and still remains) something of a mystery, with its origins apparently in the early 1850s, the later addition of a finale (replacing the alternative version now known to be in the archive at Münster) and the story of the elderly Gernsheim remembering the first movement motto/rhythm many years later.

[Mark Thomas]

Another thing which struck me quite forcibly is how similar Grimm's orchestral palette is to Hiller's - more so than to Schumann's. In a way I guess that shouldn't be surprising as Hiller was regarded as a very prominent and influential composer in the 1850s when Grimm started work on the Symphony and, of course, it doesn't detract from his achievement. 

[Alan Howe]

Two aspects of the Symphony stand out for me: first, the sheer memorability of the themes in all four movements and second, the motto/rhythm which permeates the whole of the opening movement. I wonder whether Bruckner could possibly have encountered it?

The performance from one of Germany's many medium-sized regional orchestras is pretty good too. It sounds to me that conductor Golo Berg believes in every bar of the work. Now we need one or two more recordings to see what other conductors and orchestras make of it.
 

[Alan Howe]

I have just received this reply from conductor Golo Berg in response to my email congratulating him on the release of his recording:

<<Thank you for your kind words! It's truly very satisfying to better understand the context and complete my own picture of this period. With the works of Grimm in my ear, for example, I understand Brahms better.

I would be happy to write to you what I know about your questions:

Grimm himself performed his symphony 11 times in Münster (between 1861 and 1898). He also conducted performances in Göttingen and Leipzig (e.g., at the Gewandhaus on January 16, 1873). Grimm's successor, Wilhelm Nissen, also performed the symphony (including on November 15, 1905, at the unveiling of the Grimm monument). On February 23, 1884, the symphony was heard in Boston (conductor: George Henschel). Older research literature also mentions performances in Philadelphia and London (but without specific dates or corresponding sources). Unfortunately, I cannot tell you whether the symphony was still performed later in the 20th century.

The earlier version of the final movement is quite interesting. It might be worthwhile to produce an edition sometime.

So that you can get a sense of this version for yourself, I am sending you the link to the digitized source: In the DFG Viewer, the sentence can be found on pages 100 to 127:

https://dfg-viewer.de/show?id=9>>

Can anyone help with the link that Mr Berg has sent me?

[cypressdome]

The full url should be Image 100 from Verschiedenen Noten und Kompositionen von Julius Otto Grimm Band 2.

Or you can download the images as a PDF from IMSLP.

From Grimm's digitized estate I was also able to find several unpublished choral works (some incomplete) that are now available on IMSLP: Gesang der Mönche, Lied des fahrenden Schülers, Moltke †, Trinklied an Bakchos, and Bei der Einkleidung. There are also the published full score and parts to two patriotic pieces: An Kaiser Wilhelm II and Zum Geburtsfeste des Kaisers.

[Alan Howe]

Thanks - very kind of you.

And so here's my urgent plea: might we now find out what the alternative finale to Grimm's Symphony actually sounds like?