Unsung Composers

The Music => Composers & Music => Topic started by: giles.enders on Saturday 01 September 2012, 11:00

Title: Charles-Wilfride de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: giles.enders on Saturday 01 September 2012, 11:00
Charles-Wilfride de Beriot Born 12.2.1833 Paris  -  Died 22.10.1914 Sceaux-en-Gatinais

The illegitimate son of composer Charles Auguste de Beriot 1802-1870 and Maria Malibran.  His maternal grandfather was the composer and singer Manuel del Popolo Vicente Garcia 1775-1832.  Among Manuel's children were two daughters. Maria Felicia 1808-1836 who taking her husbands name was best known as the singer Maria Malibran.  Her sister Michelle Pauline 1821-1910 also took her husbands name and was the singer and composer Pauline Viadot-Garcia.

Charles -Wilfride's mother died and his stepmother, Maria Huber was the adopted daughter of the natural father of Sigismond Thalberg.  It was Thalberg who among others gave Charles-Wilfrede his music lessons.

Charles-Wilfride later became a professor at the Paris Conservatory where among his pupils was  Maurice Ravel.  He also taught Enrique Granados privately.

Orchestral

Piano Concerto No.1  Op.40    pub. by J Hamelle
Piano Concerto No.2  in C minor Op.46  1881   pub. by J Hamelle
Piano Concerto No.3  Op.71    pub. by J Hamelle
Piano Concerto No.4  Op.83   pub. by J Hamelle

Chamber

Piano Quartet in A minor  Op.50  pub. by J Hamelle 1881
Piano Quartet in D minor  Op.55   pub by J Hamelle
Flute Sonata  Op.64
Sonata for two pianos  Op.61

Piano

Tarantelle Op.3
La Revues 1855
Three Equisses for piano  1862
Ballad Op.12  1861   pub. by Schott
Mazurka  1862
Two Mazurkas  1863
Impromptu  1864
Valse Mignonne  Op.29
Valse 1872
Allegretto  Op.35
Le Courrier Op.31 1879  pub. by Alphonse Leduc
Ronde de Nuit  in F minor  1880   pub. by Durand, Schoenewerke & Cie
Rondo Martial
Scherzando  Op.39 1879  pub. by Durand, Schoenewerke & Cie.
Variations on an original theme
'La Sortie du Port' barcarolle
'A la Espanola, bolero  Op.60
Method - Mecanisms and Style  Op.66


Song

Desperance  pub. by J. Betrand
L'Espirit du Mal  pub. by J. Bertrand
J'etais sa Promise
Mon bon Ange
On me croit coquette
Ondine
Paola



Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Mark Thomas on Saturday 01 September 2012, 11:20
My word, what a complicated family tree - in a later age he'd have been a shoe-in for "Who do you think you are"! I have a  recording of his Second Piano Concerto which I'll happily upload if it's of interest.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: JimL on Saturday 01 September 2012, 11:27
It is indeed! ;D
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: giles.enders on Saturday 01 September 2012, 11:34
I would like it too.  I have been unable to trace the fourth concerto though is is referred to in various places.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Mark Thomas on Saturday 01 September 2012, 12:04
The recording of the Piano Concerto No.2 is now available here (http://www.unsungcomposers.com/forum/index.php/topic,3760.0.html).
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: semloh on Sunday 02 September 2012, 11:48
Quote from: Mark Thomas on Saturday 01 September 2012, 12:04
The recording of the Piano Concerto No.2 is now available here (http://www.unsungcomposers.com/forum/index.php/topic,3760.0.html).

I've searched high and low for the titles of the movements, but no luck at all. I think maybe it's one for Eric!  :)
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Mark Thomas on Sunday 02 September 2012, 13:08
The meister-researcher! BTW, I was in error in saying the source of the recording was an LP. It was a radio broadcast I now see.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Sunday 02 September 2012, 19:12
I tried. Will keep trying. (And am flattered, but... er... erm... hush, Eric.)
If I may delegate (or rather, transfer approbation or blame) :) there seem to be copies of the Hamelle score - and/or 2-piano reduction - elsewhere - people near them may have more luck than me (I should think they would). One is at the University of Colorado at Boulder (in their Ricardo Viñes Piano Music Collection).  Another is in a library in Poland- will have to figure out which one; the Worldcat link is broken, but may still be able to by, well, using NUKAT more directly- will do soon.

Dubal claims that Viñes (one of Bériot's pupils...) played this work in his Paris début...
(Of course, programs/playbills of performances are one source sometimes of just such movement listings so if I can find -that-... maybe it's reproduced in a bio of Ricardo Viñes somewhere :) )
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Sunday 02 September 2012, 19:16
In Greene's Biographical Encyclopedia of Composers (page 1034): "his (Ravel's) teacher (in 1891- Eric) was Charles de Bériot (1802-70)..."

proofreader, proofreader, where is thy sting? (And David Mason Greene is actually rather good, too. Here I agree with my father...)
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 06 September 2012, 01:34
Cantrelle looks wrong, btw, but apparently several recordings by him (from 60 years ago or so) are mentioned at Worldcat, and indeed a recording conducted by him of "Charles-Auguste de Beriot" piano concerto no.1 (perhaps very badly mislabeled in both composer and piece and the 2nd concerto of Charles-Wilfrid yes...) seems to be in the BM Lyon library catalog (on 3 78s.)
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Boulder on Saturday 15 September 2012, 19:02
re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot's piano concerto #2, op. 46--
In the published version from the Ricardo Vines collection at the University of Colorado ("IIe concerto pour le piano avec accompagnement d'orchestre ou de 2e piano, " OCLC #50649800), the concerto is in two movements. The first is marked Allegro moderato; the second is marked Intermezzo (with a metronome mark of quarter note = 72), leading to Andante, leading to Allegro.

A pianist on the faculty of the music school happened to be in the library when I was inquiring about the de Beriot score. He is familiar with the library's holdings of music by both Charles-Wilfrid and Charles Auguste de Beriot. If contributors to UC have further questions, please e-mail me, and I will connect you with this generous man.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 17 September 2012, 03:48
Thank you! (I wonder if they have the full score- their catalog lists only a reduction- but that information is already very useful and much appreciated. :) )
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: JimL on Monday 17 September 2012, 06:03
Quote from: Boulder on Saturday 15 September 2012, 19:02
re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot's piano concerto #2, op. 46--
In the published version from the Ricardo Vines collection at the University of Colorado ("IIe concerto pour le piano avec accompagnement d'orchestre ou de 2e piano, " OCLC #50649800), the concerto is in two movements. The first is marked Allegro moderato; the second is marked Intermezzo (with a metronome mark of quarter note = 72), leading to Andante, leading to Allegro.
I would say it's likelier that the tempo of the Intermezzo is Andante.  Intermezzo isn't a tempo indication but an actual title (like scherzo, or finale).
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: JimL on Monday 17 September 2012, 06:05
Is there any chance of finding out what the orchestra is on that download?
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Wednesday 26 February 2014, 22:42
well, there are at least 4 piano concertos (all published by Hamelle, the first in 1881, from something I noted last night, I think...) - Opp.40, 46, 70 and 83. Wouldn't mind seeing (uploaded to IMSLP, would be my druthers) all 4 of them in some form (reduced, parts and or full-score), myself, assuming the publication dates on all 4 allow (I'd assume all 4 are even PD-US, but am not sure.)
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: jdperdrix on Thursday 27 February 2014, 09:46
The score of the first two piano concerto (with orchestra or 2nd piano) appear in the catalogue of the Bibliothèque nationale de France:
http://catalogue.bnf.fr (http://catalogue.bnf.fr)
The third also in the 2 pianos reduction. I didn't find the third..
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 27 February 2014, 10:11
Thanks!
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: FBerwald on Saturday 04 February 2017, 08:48
The recording of Piano Cncerto No. 2 seems to have disappeared. Could someone re-upload it?
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: adriano on Saturday 04 February 2017, 10:14
It's on YouTube, but with horrible acustics, do you really want this?
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Saturday 04 February 2017, 20:11
I think Mark's upload was in better sound IIRC. But if Mark could upload it again, I for one would be most grateful. The YouTube sound is pretty awful.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Saturday 04 February 2017, 20:33
Quote
The score of the first two piano concerto (with orchestra or 2nd piano) appear in the catalogue of the Bibliothèque nationale de France:
http://catalogue.bnf.fr
The third also in the 2 pianos reduction. I didn't find the third..

The catalogue information supplied is not detailed enough to determine whether the scores of PCs 1 & 2 are full score (perhaps with parts) or merely 2-piano reductions. Accordingly, I have fired off an enquiry to BNF. It is the 4th PC that they have in 2-piano reduction only (this is clearly specified in the catalogue data). I could not find any record of No. 3.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Sunday 05 February 2017, 00:00
According to BNF there was a recording of the first piano concerto in 78-rpm days, with Peter Wallfisch (1924-93) piano? (http://catalogue.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/cb37913604v (http://catalogue.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/cb37913604v))

(From http://catalogue.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/cb37913601t (http://catalogue.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/cb37913601t) Wallfisch & Cantrell may have recorded one of the other Bériot concertos too?)
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Mark Thomas on Monday 06 February 2017, 11:04
I've been away for a few weeks, so my apologies for not doing this earlier, but I've restored my recording of de Bériot's 2nd Piano Concerto to the Downloads board here (http://www.unsungcomposers.com/forum/index.php/topic,6377.0.html). The sound does leave something to be desired, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: adriano on Monday 06 February 2017, 14:34
Thanks, Mark :-)
The Bériot Piano Concerto is also mentioned in here. As sometimes in those days, orchestras were not named
http://oldmusicautographs.blogspot.ch/2012/01/charles-wilfrid-de-beriot-scion-of.html
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Wednesday 08 February 2017, 14:53
The BNF has replied to the effect that they do not have full scores of any of de Beriot's PCs.  The Ricardo Vines Collection at the University of Colorado has the 2-piano scores of all 4 of de Beriot's concertos but no orchestral material. So we are still searching.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Wednesday 08 February 2017, 21:02
Hrm. By the way, apparently U. Colorado at Boulder, and a couple of other libraries, also do have the 2-piano reduction of the Op.46 2nd concerto, so it may be possible to borrow them without paying BNF. Still, at the moment I'm coming up nil on the orchestral material. The conductor or someone associated with the orchestra in the recording probably knew, but - probably deceased...
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Wednesday 08 February 2017, 21:53
Quoteapparently U. Colorado at Boulder, and a couple of other libraries, also do have the 2-piano reduction of the Op.46 2nd concerto

I know that. I said above that U. of Colorado has 2-piano scores of ALL 4 of the concerti. It's the orchestral material that is missing - as is so often the case. In fact Boulder has two copies of No. 2, both of the 2-piano score. Peter Wallfisch, the pianist on the YouTube recording, was Raphael Wallfisch's father. I don't know Raphael personally. but Simon Callaghan does, so I have asked him to enquire if he (Raphael) has any clues.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 09 February 2017, 03:17
Sorry :(
Are there any good Bériot biographies out there?
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: giles.enders on Tuesday 30 July 2019, 11:30
After several years, I wonder if anyone has managed to locate the full scores of piano concertos 1.3.&4. It would be very useful if they have.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Tuesday 30 July 2019, 11:43
I have had no luck to date, I'm afraid. You omit PC2 - does that mean the full score of that work has been located?
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: giles.enders on Tuesday 30 July 2019, 12:57
There was an ancient recording of No.2 on youtube so assumed the score was extant. Bit sloppy I know
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Tuesday 30 July 2019, 16:07
I haven't been able to find it, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 05 August 2019, 13:44
Giles: "score" in the sense of "score and parts or at least just parts" were extant - a conductor could do with a very well-marked reduction, I imagine. (assuming conductor, too. ... someone sometime is going to have to explain to me -- sometime -- whether conductorless orchestras always use scores or sometimes everyone just parts... :) )
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Monday 05 August 2019, 15:47
Agreed, Eric. But, although I have made extensive enquiries, I have not been able to locate either full score or orchestral parts of any of the PCs. They must have existed at one time of course and, using a 2-piano score, could probably be reconstructed from the recordings (at least in the case of 2 - on YouTube - and possibly 1 - if BnF catalogue is correct and they have it). This, however, would be a labour of love for someone.
Title: Re: Charles-Wilfrid de Beriot 1833-1914
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 05 August 2019, 17:17
Understood, sorry!