I see that not too many people in the forum have a favourable view of the music of Frederic Cowen (1852-1935). Admittedly we haven't yet had the opportunity to hear some of his strongest work on disc. The problem with Cowen is compounded by the fact that so many of his (unpublished) autograph full scores are missing, including his first two symphonies, an 1881 Sinfonietta, numerous overtures, and all four of his major operas 'Pauline' (1876), 'Thorgrim' (1890), 'Signa' (1892) and 'Harold' (1895). He did not have any children and the whereabouts of his personal music library is a mystery.
I would number Cowen amongst the five most significant late-Victorian British composers, along with Sullivan, Mackenzie, Parry and Stanford. In 1866, after just seven months of study, his parents recalled him from Leipzig due to the outbreak of the Franco-Prussian War. Although he returned to Germany (Berlin) in 1867 to study privately with Kiel and Taubert, he did not benefit from the 'Conservatoire' route that shaped many of his contemporaries.
Cowen was a master of the lighter genres - predominantly the orchestral suite rather than the symphony. His symphonic works are attractive but not constructed with the intellectual rigour of Parry's or the suave expertise of Stanford's. The Marco Polo recording of the 3rd is truly dismal (as is the whole disc), but the Classico performance of the 6th I think reveals many of Cowen's characteristics, especially the deft orchestration. This music does not sound like his British contemporaries, if anything it has always struck me as Anglicized Grieg. We need really good performances of the 3rd, 4th and 5th before we can even begin to fully assess Cowen's stature. The 5th was actually recorded a couple of years ago by the BBC in sessions left over from one of their Dutton recordings, but to my knowledge (and despite several enquiries to the Corporation) this sight-read performance has never been broadcast.
Of Cowen's major works that were either published in full score or where the autograph is still extant, I would recommend the following for serious consideration, with an asterisk indicating that an adequate recording already exists:
Symphony No.3 'Scandinavian' (1880)
The Language of the Flowers, First Suite (1880)
Symphony No.4 (1884)
Sleeping Beauty, cantata (1885)
Symphony No.5 (1887)
The Water-Lily, cantata (1892)
In Fairyland, Suite (1896)
Symphony No.6 (1897)*
The Dream of Endymion, tenor and orchestra (1897)
Ode to the Passions, chorus and orchestra (1898)
Concertstuck, for piano and orchestra (1900)
The Butterfly's Ball, Overture (1901)
A Phantasy of Life and Love (1901)
John Gilpin, chorus and orchestra (1904)
A Suite of Old English Dances, Second Set (1905)
The Veil, cantata (1910)
The Months, 12 short pieces for orchestra (1912)
The Language of the Flowers, Second Suite (1914)
One solitary asterisk! I would not recommend the 1903 'Indian Rhapsody' (recorded by Marco Polo) even if a better performance could be secured, or the first Suite of English Dances (1896) but everything else I would whole-heartedly endorse. It is wonderful news that the Concertstuck (written for Paderewski) is scheduled for inclusion in volume 55 of Hyperion's Romantic Piano Concerto series, and this will hopefully encourage other recordings. Five of Cowen's extant choral works are included in the above list - these, I think, are the strongest and deserve to be heard again.
...I would not recommend the 1903 'Indian Rhapsody' (recorded by Marco Polo) even if a better performance could be secured...
Why, I wonder? It's by far the most attractive Cowen piece I've heard. A fine performance, well-recorded, would be delightful, in my book.
David
I simply don't think it represents Cowen at anywhere near his best! Despite some colourful orchestration, I think the melodic material is contrived and lacks spontaneity. The striving after 'orientalisms' seems to me to be very laboured and the whole thing is a bit of a rambling mess: even given the leeway allowed by the term 'Rhapsody', I don't think that this particular example hangs together at all with it's unsubtle and unintegrated sectional structure. If others disagree with this opinion and experience more positive reactions to the 'Indian Rhapsody', I'm only too glad!
I would say that Cowen demands the same sort of critical support as Holbrooke - with many works to champion it is important that stronger pieces are given prominence over weaker ones. I'm glad that Hyperion will be giving us the 'Concertstuck' which is in reality another Rhapsody, but a much more impressive achievement:
"Although entitled a Concertstuck, the piece is more or less of the nature of a Rhapsody, while much of the thematic material is quite characteristic of the composer, and the pianoforte part, which is more important than the orchestral, is most brilliant, and often very difficult. It is about half a dozen short movements linked together without a break, the last section recalling some of the themes already heard. This, indeed, and the last movement but one, which may almost remind the hearer of some of the Rhapsodies of Liszt, are most effective portions of the work" (Daily News, 29 June 1900)
Compared to the 'Indian Rhapsody' there is ingenious thematic development in the 'Concertstuck' within a basic slow-quick-slow-quick (coda) structure. Having read the score published by Joseph Williams I can't wait to hear it!
I couldn't possibly put Cowen in the same league as Parry, Sullivan and Stanford - nor Mackenzie for that matter. A much more substantial composer in every way was Algernon Ashton...
We must agree to disagree on this one! Judging from the vocal scores of 'Thorgrim' (Novello), 'Signa' (Ascherberg) and 'Harold' (Joseph Williams) Cowen's accomplishment in opera was very real, certainly superior to Stanford's early efforts in 'The Veiled Prophet' (Boosey), 'The Canterbury Pilgrims' (Boosey) and 'Savonarola' (privately printed). Incidentally, also much stronger works than Stanford's are Arthur Goring Thomas's 'Esmeralda' (1883) and 'Nadeshda' (1885) both written for Carl Rosa.
Likewise, the five choral works I included all indicate a very real talent which cannot be fully realised until we are more familiar with them in orchestral performance. They show a very strong and personal melodic gift allied to word-setting close to Sullivan in its skill and regard for the inflections of language.
As to Algernon Ashton, the loss of his large-scale orchestral works is indeed a tragedy, so any attempt to assess them in terms of his contemporaries must necessarily be the wildest speculation - his piano music is a different matter. Nobody has heard Cowen's music beyond the little that has been recorded (and 'The Dream of Endymion', performed by the Broadheath Singers some years back) and fewer still have taken the time to look at what published scores there are.
Cowen's 3rd and 6th are way inferior to anything written by Parry or Stanford; by comparison he's a lightweight. Of course, we don't have everything by Ashton, but by the side of Cowen, he was a compositional giant.
Sorry: as you say, we'll have to agree to disagree on this, but I'm not holding my breath at the thought of new issues of Cowen's music (although I'd buy them, of course!)
Just precisely how (by analysis, not supposition) is Cowen (judged by his total output) a "compositional lightweight": in the mould of Arthur Sullivan and Edward German perhaps (this is intentionally ironic). This is a truly pejorative criticism of the worst order. His 3rd and 6th are "way inferior to anything written by Parry or Stanford" - have you really listened attentively to Parry's 'Overture to an Unwritten Tragedy' or Stanford's Overture to 'The Canterbury Pilgrims'?
Pretty obviously I was comparing like with like: Cowen 6, even in the alert performance by Bostock, is pretty thin stuff for a lot of the time (I'm listening attentively to it as I write this) and much of what I hear, especially of the 2nd movement, is more akin to (skilfully written) light music. It just doesn't have the same ambition, let alone quality as any of the symphonies of Parry or Stanford. The slow movement, I grant you, is attractive, but I just can't get excited by this ever-so civilised music. It seems to me that, on the evidence, of the 6th, there are many better composers out there deserving of our attention. As I said, let's agree to disagree; but do let's keep the stature of Cowen in proper perspective.
And, by the way, I'd swap anything I've heard by Cowen (admittedly not all that much, but, as I said, I'm not holding my breath on the evidence presented so far) for Sullivan's marvellous Symphony.
The stature of Cowen is still an unknown quantity, as is the stature of any composer whose lifetime achievement is unavailable to the listener through good live performance or competent recording. Skilfully written light music is not to be derided - as Alexander Mackenzie found in writing 'His Majesty' for the Savoy in 1897 it requires a special kind of genius which Sullivan had but Mackenzie most certainly did not. A symphony does not have to plumb the depths of passion or present an intellectual conundrum - it can simply entertain, as many of Haydn's do. I was entertained by Cowen's 6th, but a chacun son gout! There are probably many "better" composers than Frederic Cowen, but this forum should give all a fair hearing based on a wider knowledge than simply what is already available on compact disc.
And you've been getting a fair hearing. But we should be realistic as well as fair. And Cowen's just not a composer of real stature - IMHO, of course.
One of my all time favourite recordings is of Frederic Cowen's 3rd Symphony on Marco Polo. However, by comparison, I found his 6th Symphony on Classico rather disappointing, much preferring the "fill up" of Samuel Coleridge-Taylor's fine youthful Symphony in A minor.
Symphonies 3 and 6 are in their best production, I believe that we should not judge it by its contemporaries, but focus on him and his real purpose in writing was not as ambitious as his contemporaries, rather I think they settle for making music light to listen and understand, even for the very little that I've heard (the overture butterfly, is charming) I think it is in my humble opinion a composer worthy of being studied, and listened, with very characteristic features.
sullivan and stanford are a world apart. :-\
I remain open minded towards Cowen,and would certainly buy a cd of his music,even though,I have to say,I have been disappointed by what I have heard to date. What cannot be denied is the fact that he was a major figure in his time & in that respect I think he is worth investigating.
As to Stanford,I must confess to having all of his symphonies on cd,and the Chandos recording of 'Songs of the Fleet' (etc),but,without wishing to upset anyone here,find them all rather bland & forgettable. No 5 certainly has it's moments,is beautifully orchestrated & the introduction of the organ in the finale is quite ingenious & genuinely imaginative,the Fourth is quite good fun. But overall I would rather listen to the infinitely superior symphonies of Hubert Parry,which are quite wonderful,and everything that Stanford's aren't. As to the 'Songs of the Fleet. HMS Pinafore & 'The Pirates of Penzance' have just about twice as much sea salt in them and oodles more fun (Decca D'oyly Carte for me).
Apologies,however,to anyone who enjoys Stanford. Each to his own,as they say.
I should really have said,that his 'Irish rhapsodies' are, in my opinion, mini masterpieces.
As someone whose Ph.D was on Cowen's music (University of Durham, 2007), I think I can justify a few comments on this forum...It is fair to say that during my seven years of in depth study of his music in the lead up to the submission of my thesis, I was constantly torn between doing my utmost to promote Cowen's music, to give it an airing (which would aid my own assessment of the quality of his music) and being realistic that the standing of his opera was not great even at the end of his life, partly thanks to George Bernard Shaw's vociferous condemnation of many of his works in Shaw's newspaper and journal criticism. His reputation as a ballad-monger has not helped him either.
As several observers have already remarked, Cowen was at his best when writing in the lighter forms and genres: his overtures and orchestral suites show a composer who could excel at writing graceful melody with deft and colourful orchestration. However, as soon as he turned his hand to the bigger forms: symphonies, operas etc., he was unable to conjure up the deeper emotions and control his structures in a fashion that was satisfying and invigorating.
Looking at Cowen's symphonies, one tends to find the most satisfying parts are in the middle movements, where he does not need to be complex or substantially develop his material. In the outer movements, Cowen's ability to create material suitable for development is often wanting, with him relying on repetition of material and variation, rather than engaging in combining material from different subject groups. Ultimately, a lot of Cowen's difficulties as a composer lay in his inability to write satisfying climaxes: he just seems incapable of getting himself and his audience worked up into a frenzy as most first-rate composers can.
Turning to the 'Scandinavian' Symphony (No. 3), it perplexes most commentators today as to why it could have ever been at one time the most performed British symphony both nationally and internationally (until the arrival of Elgar's First). Indeed, the outer movements are less than satisfactory, especially the finale, a movement that seems to echo the equivalent movement of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, by recapitulating themes from earlier in the symphony. However, it is utterly unconvincing, with its episodic nature frequently disrupting the flow and progress of the movement. Moreover, the movement's main thematic material is barely developed and just repeated. The difficulties of promoting this work are further impeded by the Marco Polo recording of it. Not only is the orchestra, at best, mediocre (the strings sound scrappy and indistinct at times, and the intonation of the orchestra, especially the brass, is also suspect in places), but the sound technicians have produced a lifeless recording, lacking depth of tone, with the microphones so close that one can actually hear the woodwind players depressing the keys of their instruments. Despite its evident weaknesses, this symphony deserves a first-rate recording.
The Classico recording of Cowen's 'Idyllic' Symphony (No. 6) is a much better affair. Both orchestra and sound recording team have done the work justice. From a musical point of view, again the middle movements are probably the most convincing, and yet the melodious and elegant outer movements are worth a hearing. I would dare to say that there are some Tchaikovskyan and pseudo-Elgarian moments in this work. Indeed, Cowen executes some half-decent climaxes too. Cowen did comment that many composers had fallen under Tchaikovsky's spell and it would seem that he was no exception. He had also become acquainted with some of Elgar's music by this time as a conductor, and later correspondence suggests that they became good friends as they headed towards the ends of their respective lives.
The Indian Rhapsody is one of Cowen's most troublesome pieces, mostly on account of its complete geographical and musical disorder: it is clear that Cowen knows very little about authentic Indian music. Indeed, listening to this work, one may be forgiven for not being sure if one was in Scotland, the Middle East or the Far East, as the musical metaphors are so confused! One commentator described it as a 'Chinese market', and this was not meant as a compliment! As a piece, even the term rhapsody, implying an episodic, but integrated free-flowing style, is perhaps generous. And yet, I forgive Cowen for his lack of knowledge of the music of India and for all its weaknesses structurally and musically, as he accomplishes a romping coda, not unlike a similar moment in his choral work John Gilpin. Its orchestration has a number of fine features and there are even moments akin to Rimsky-Korsakov's Scheherazade. However, like with the other pieces on the Marco Polo CD, the production team has not conveyed the merits of the work to best advantage.
The Butterfly's Ball Overture suffers from the same recording issues cited above, but the sheer melody and grace of this trifle does shine through. This is Cowen in safe territory, dealing with child-like subject matter, whether it is dancing insects or flittering fairies, where his muse for writing is most at home.
As many commentators have already observed, Cowen may not have had the intellectual and dramatic skills of his contemporaries such as Parry, Stanford and Elgar, but much of his music is craftsman-like, and should not be dismissed out of hand. He was one of the most important home-grown (even if he was born in Jamaica) composer, conductors of the Victorian and Edwardian era; he did much to promote the music of his colleagues, including Elgar, and deserves more recognition for his role in the British renaissance at the end of the nineteenth century than his current critique suggests.
Christopher J. Parker (Dr)
Wonderful post. Informed, interesting, instructive...thanks.
David
Quote from: parkermusic on Thursday 03 June 2010, 12:15
As many commentators have already observed, Cowen may not have had the intellectual and dramatic skills of his contemporaries such as Parry, Stanford and Elgar, but much of his music is craftsman-like, and should not be dismissed out of hand. He was one of the most important home-grown (even if he was born in Jamaica) composer, conductors of the Victorian and Edwardian era; he did much to promote the music of his colleagues, including Elgar, and deserves more recognition for his role in the British renaissance at the end of the nineteenth century than his current critique suggests.
What an excellent post - I can strongly recommend Christopher Parker's thesis (available through the very efficient Ethos service at the British Library) to anybody with an interest in British music of the period. Cowen's music was primarily written to entertain, not to challenge. If taken on these terms his achievement becomes quite considerable - certainly fully worthy of further informed exploration.
I wonder if many of the same criticisms could be leveled against the extended works of Gershwin.
The analysis of Dr Parker is right on target, so far as I'm concerned. However, just based on my own occasional listening to Cowen (and total ignorance of his other works), I'll offer a comment.
I can fully understand why Cowen's 3rd symphony would be popular. Despite the lack of gravitas, the orchestral figures and effects are quite engaging. Little playful themes keep popping up, and other passages are totally charming. Yes, this is light music, but it is entertaining light music. And that is the novelty actor that I think was attractive to many listeners. When one is exposed endlessly to the heavyweights (sorry about the pun) of classical music, a bit of lighter fare is a nice respite. Which usually means, for variety, Mozart with all his major key ditties and fluff. But Mozart is so overplayed and predictable, Cowen is a less familiar alternative, more modern and just fun listening.
The Butterfly Ball is not as inventive, perhaps, as the S3, but engaging nonetheless. And I totally agree on the embarrassingly bad Indian Rhapsody. Any composer who writes something like that deserves to be ostracized and ridiculed.
I've heard nothing else by Cowen, and do not think I would pay actual money to hear anything else. But for those who like British light music, I'd think Cowen would be worthy of a place in their collection. His 3rd symphony and Butterfly Ball are, as Albion notes, quite entertaining.
That said, I hope we can leave Gershwin out of this conversation. Whatever the criticisms of Gershwin as a composer, the influence of his music and his stature as a composer in the overall pantheon are undeniable and enduring. Cowen will ever remain nearly invisible, pretty much unsung even among the unsungs.
Amphissa, your comments on Cowen strike me as making a strong case for the composer's talents. I was not trying to steer the thread towards Gershwin at all (which is why my response was short -- too short, perhaps). Rather, I was hoping someone like yourself (perhaps also Mr. Parker) would address the question of why Cowen's music must rise or fall on his mastery of developmental techniques. Gershwin's doesn't. Your own response goes very much in the direction I was thinking of.
There is an extensive list, which once included Mahler, of unsung composers dismissed out of hand because either their developmental techniques or their contrapuntal techniques or both were found lacking. I'm a big fan of developmental and contrapuntal techniques myself, but I do feel that too many unsung composers have gotten short shrift simply because they didn't fit into some academic's or critic's received opinion of precisely how musical argument is supposed to work.
True, I am not a stickler for structure and development, which can often be intellectually interesting in a academic way, but ineffectual and uninteresting to me (Draeseke being a case in point).
Maybe a more fertile comparison for Cowen would be Bantock, who threw together amazingly beautiful passages of orchestral music into patchwork compositions that are wonderful to listen to, despite the fact that they go nowhere. They have more drama and weight than Cowen, but rarely rise above the level of entertainment. I enjoy entertaining music at times, but I don't confuse it with "great art" music.
With regards to Cowen S3, I realise I got a little caught up in the structural arguments about the music of the symphony, without explaining why it may have had such popularity. Amphissa is absolutely right, despite its weaknesses developmentally and structurally, there are several attractive ideas and effects that keep one interested; the music is still good entertainment and I enjoy the work too.
In response to chill319, I would say that, like Amphissa, I am not a stickler for structure, development and contrapuntal inventiveness either, from a listening and enjoyment point of view, but when one is analysing such a work as a symphony, one can't ignore these issues, as comments on how the work compares to the 'conventions' of what is expected in a symphony have to be made. Symphonies are normally, rightly or wrongly, judged by these standards. It is just Cowen's symphonies do lack this convincing developmental element. Your point about Gershwin is a very valid one. I am also a Mahler fan too, and would never say that a work should rise or fall purely on its structure or development. I apologise if I implied this.
Returning to Cowen, as Albion so succinctly puts it, his music was 'written to entertain, not to challenge'. I enjoy entertainment sometimes and I enjoy the challenge of 'great art music' at others!
I suppose anyone who chose to name their work 'symphony' around the turn of the 20th century was suggesting that the work should be listened to against one's experience of other symphonies -- which after Haydn, Beethoven, and Mendelssohn were the place to display developmental and contrapuntal techniques.
Anyone who considers Mahler to be inadequate in his developmental and contrapuntal skills must have rocks in his head! Does anybody think that he spends more time in his massive movements exposing or reprising his materials?
I do agree that Parry and Stanford are more important composers than Cowen, but I still think that much of what I've heard of his music is enjoyable, especially the 6th symphony. However, I agree with John that the Coleridge Taylor on the same disc is the most interesting work on that CD.
Slightly off the topic, If any one is interested in Cowen's grave it is in the Jewish Cemetary in Golders Green< London. This was not his 'birth' name and strangely he was born in Jamaica and brought to London as a child.
Giles Enders
I forgot to mention that Cowen's real name was Hyman Cohen in case anybody is interested.
Giles Enders
It might be worthwhile to give a few definitions from Cowen's 1915 satirical volume "Music As She Is Wrote/Being A Glossary of Musical Terms _Very Much_ Up To Date", especially
ACADEMY - A place of illusion for young musical students who wish to earn their own livelihood when they come out of it.
ACCENT - Used mostly by foreign Conductors when trying to speak English to the orchestra. [Cowen was probably thinking specifically of Hans Richter, whose English was spectacularly garbled at times.]
AD LIB (or ad libitum) - Latin for "Take what liberties you please' with any phrase or passage. This indication is usually quite superfluous.
ATTACCA - When this word occurs it means that the artist should go on to the next movement without giving the audience time to applaud. Should it (the audience) have had no intention of doing so this saves any misunderstanding or unpleasant feeling on either side.
ATTACK - The commonest forms of this are- nervousness, jealousy and in the newspapers. [Amphissa's _Indian Rhapsody_ assessment "Any composer who writes something like that deserves to be ostracized and ridiculed" brought this to mind. Sorry.]
CHORD - Any number of notes - the more the better - played or struck simultaneously. This can be done in many different and surprising ways.
COMPASS - The range of any instrument. The term, however, cannot be applied to a kitchen range, even though it may possess a "grate" compass. N.B.- A mariner's compass usually goes from C to C. [Cowen loves puns, and this is a portmanteau groaner.]
COMPOSER - Anyone of any nationality (except British) who composes. (See Artist.) [Remember, Cowen's fighting the good fight in 1915.]
and two last, otherwise I'll type the whole book (which is wonderful):
COMPOSITION - The art of absorbing the musical ideas of others and reproducing them in such a way that they shall be sufficiently unrecognizable to the composer and scarcely less so to the listener.
OPERA - A stage play, with a more or less unintelligible plot, set to music for a very large orchestra. There are also a certain number of singers who impersonate the characters in the piece as ably as their age and size will permit. These are, however, somewhat superfluous, as their words are always inaudible and their music usually unsingable. The 1st Act of an Opera is often omitted - by the audience.
Whatever you think of Cowen's music, he certainly had wit.
Quote from: giles.enders on Tuesday 22 June 2010, 11:40
I forgot to mention that Cowen's real name was Hyman Cohen in case anybody is interested.
Giles Enders
Well whaddya know! My Granddad's name was Hyman! However, I'm a Levite. ;D
I understood that people with the surname Cohen were descended from the priestly tribe of Levy. I also read somewhere that Frederic Cowen's father, before he brought the family across to England, changed the family name to Cowen because he feared anti-Jewish prejudice this side of the Pond.
Quote from: John H White on Wednesday 23 June 2010, 11:52
I understood that people with the surname Cohen were descended from the priestly tribe of Levy. I also read somewhere that Frederic Cowen's father, before he brought the family across to England, changed the family name to Cowen because he feared anti-Jewish prejudice this side of the Pond.
Well, John, the way I understand my Tribe, there are two classes of Jews. They are the Cohanim, who originally were the priestly class (descended from Aaron, IIRC), and the Levites, who were supposed to be the assistants to the priests, but basically were everybody else who wasn't a Cohen. The two were forbidden to intermarry, so I find it unlikely that the Cohanim were descended from the Levites. It's a pity that Avrohom isn't around when you need him.
He's the expert on this stuff. If only he hadn't had an online persona that resembled nothing so much as a porcupine surrounded by fishers... :'(
Ah but Jim, wasn't Aaron, from whom the priestly class, Cohanim or Cohens are presumably descended, also of the tribe of Levy, the Levites being all those of the tribe of Levy who were not descended from Aaron----- or have I got it all wrong again? Anyway, whoever he was descended from, I reckon Sir Frederic Cowen wrote some good tuneful stuff that deserves at least an occasional airing.
Volume 54 of Hyperion's Romantic Piano Concerto series promises the exciting prospect of Frederic Cowen's Concertstuck written for Paderewski in 1900. The full orchestral score of this substantial 'fantasia' is now available to view and download from IMSLP:
http://imslp.org/wiki/Konzertst%C3%BCck_for_Piano_and_Orchestra_%28Cowen,_Frederic_Hymen%29 (http://imslp.org/wiki/Konzertst%C3%BCck_for_Piano_and_Orchestra_%28Cowen,_Frederic_Hymen%29)
What's the coupling for the Cowen, Albion?
Answering myself, I see that it's Somervell's Concerto.
That is good news.
Shame there was not enough room for the Normandy Variations.
Thal
Quote from: thalbergmad on Monday 29 November 2010, 12:36
Shame there was not enough room for the Normandy Variations.
I'm not entirely sure, but I don't think that the Somervell
Highland Concerto and the Cowen
Concertstuck together would come near to the full length of a disc, so it is possible that the
Normandy Variations might be included.
That would be nice. It is excellent to have an all Brit disk. Perhaps the Baines might get done next year as well.
Long live the Brits.
Thal
Mike Spring told me the Normandy Variations would be included. But Hyperion have to make a new set of parts from the MS Full Score, the parts having been lost somewhere when Augeners (who published them) closed. Why am I not surprised?
Gawd, there are some careless publishers about.
Thal
Such, more or less, is what happened to the Moscheles Pastorale.
Quote from: thalbergmad on Monday 29 November 2010, 20:42
Gawd, there are some careless publishers about.
Thal
*mutters something about film scores and bonfires :( . and other examples. *
With regard to the full score of Cowen's Concertstuck on IMSLP, pages 34 and 35 contain seven bars into which a piano part has been handwritten. Admittedly it is only a very brief passage (of unknown provenance), but it may be of interest to the relevant person at Hyperion!
Quote from: Albion on Tuesday 30 November 2010, 05:07
With regard to the full score of Cowen's Concertstuck on IMSLP, pages 34 and 35 contain seven bars into which a piano part has been handwritten. Admittedly it is only a very brief passage (of unknown provenance), but it may be of interest to the relevant person at Hyperion!
Those seven bars of piano solo
do make it into the new Hyperion recording! I emailed Hyperion suggesting some further orchestral works by Cowen which would be worth investigating and Simon Perry has passed these on to Martyn Brabbins who is going to have a look through the full scores. I realise that I'm probably in a minority of one in finding this quite exciting ...
;D
Quote from: Albion on Monday 19 September 2011, 18:20
Quote from: Albion on Tuesday 30 November 2010, 05:07
With regard to the full score of Cowen's Concertstuck on IMSLP, pages 34 and 35 contain seven bars into which a piano part has been handwritten. Admittedly it is only a very brief passage (of unknown provenance), but it may be of interest to the relevant person at Hyperion!
Those seven bars of piano solo do make it into the new Hyperion recording! I emailed Hyperion suggesting some further orchestral works by Cowen which would be worth investigating and Simon Perry has passed these on to Martyn Brabbins who is going to have a look through the full scores. I realise that I'm probably in a minority of one in finding this quite exciting ...
;D
Oh...super ::) More turn of the century British music. Just what we need, more sub-Dvorak, sub-Brahms........ ;D
(I am only joking.........!)
Quote from: Albion on Thursday 01 April 2010, 10:38
I would number Cowen amongst the five most significant late-Victorian British composers, along with Sullivan, Mackenzie, Parry and Stanford. .......
I've only just noticed this suggestion, Albion. Although I suspect this was a bit of gentle provocation to kickstart the thread, surely you would count Bantock as significant enough to be included in the top five?
I think Bantock would be counted as being of the following generation...
Ah, yes, Alan. Bantock was born in 1868 and so the first 33 years of his life fall into the late Victorian period - but obviously Albion was talking about the music, and I forgot when I read that post that most of his compositions naturally date from later.
Still - hurrah for Bantock! :)
Quote from: semloh on Monday 19 September 2011, 20:43
Quote from: Albion on Thursday 01 April 2010, 10:38
I would number Cowen amongst the five most significant late-Victorian British composers, along with Sullivan, Mackenzie, Parry and Stanford. .......
I've only just noticed this suggestion, Albion. Although I suspect this was a bit of gentle provocation to kickstart the thread, surely you would count Bantock as significant enough to be included in the top five?
Cowen was born in 1852. Elgar was born five years later in 1857. Elgar was therefore 44 when Queen Victoria died. By that time he had composed the Serenade for Strings, the Enigma Variations, the Overture "Cockaigne" and the Cantatas/Oratorios "The Black Knight", "The Light of Life", "Scenes from the Saga of King Olaf", "Caractacus" and "The Dream of Gerontius" plus the Sea Pictures.
Even if we can agree that Elgar was an Edwardian composer for the symphonies, the concertos etc. does he not also qualify as a late Victorian as well? :) :)
I would think that unless you can detect a serious change in Elgar's style after the Queen's death, you'd have to call him a Victorian right up to his death, wouldn't you??
The Dream of Gerontius is absolutely my favorite choral work of all time. The final minutes always move me to tears. And I'm not even Catholic......
Yes, bring on more Cowen....
Jerry
Quote from: Dundonnell on Tuesday 20 September 2011, 00:15
Quote from: semloh on Monday 19 September 2011, 20:43
Quote from: Albion on Thursday 01 April 2010, 10:38
I would number Cowen amongst the five most significant late-Victorian British composers, along with Sullivan, Mackenzie, Parry and Stanford. .......
I've only just noticed this suggestion, Albion. Although I suspect this was a bit of gentle provocation to kickstart the thread, surely you would count Bantock as significant enough to be included in the top five?
Cowen was born in 1852. Elgar was born five years later in 1857. Elgar was therefore 44 when Queen Victoria died. By that time he had composed the Serenade for Strings, the Enigma Variations, the Overture "Cockaigne" and the Cantatas/Oratorios "The Black Knight", "The Light of Life", "Scenes from the Saga of King Olaf", "Caractacus" and "The Dream of Gerontius" plus the Sea Pictures.
Even if we can agree that Elgar was an Edwardian composer for the symphonies, the concertos etc. does he not also qualify as a late Victorian as well? :) :)
I would tend to describe a composer historically according to their main period of activity and recognition, and for late-Victorian that would mean roughly from the late 1870s to the late 1890s - so Sullivan, Mackenzie, Parry, Stanford and Cowen stand: these were the five most prominent figures acknowledged by Charles Willeby for his 1893 survey
Masters of English Music - it is salutary to compare the space in the book which is allocated to each chapter - Sullivan (103 pp), Mackenzie (70 pp), Cowen (84 pp), Parry (24 pp) and Stanford (21 pp).
Although Mackenzie, Parry, Stanford and Cowen all continued to compose well into the twentieth century and were also therefore 'Edwardians' and subsequently 'Georgians', their heyday was the late-Victorian period.
Elgar's early choral works (up to
Gerontius) and the
Enigma Variations were written before 1901, but they are very much the tail-end of the Victorian era, presaging his full musical maturity in the decade(s) to follow: to me at least, they seem to be somehow super-imposed on the 1890s rather than growing organically out of their surroundings. Likewise it would be rather strange to label Ethel Smyth (born only a year after Elgar in 1858) as a Victorian composer despite her 1893 Mass in D and 1898 opera
Fantasio, or even Samuel Coleridge-Taylor, despite the
Hiawatha Trilogy (1898-1900). Yes, these were works written during the closing years of the nineteenth-century, but the greater and more substantial part of their composers' creative lives followed post-1901: similar strictly 'Victorian' works can be found in the catalogues of Bantock, Holbrooke and Vaughan Williams, to name three further examples.
;)
I confess that there was a substantial dash of pedantry in my comments ;D
Quote from: Dundonnell on Tuesday 20 September 2011, 14:32
I confess that there was a substantial dash of pedantry in my comments ;D
Naughty, naughty!
;)
Dundonnell, pedantic? Neh - you simply pay attention to detail. In any case, as a seasoned nitpicker myself, I reckon it's no bad thing. After all, if one wasn't a 'pedant' one might be a 'pendant'! :)
By the way, some of us know you as a key contributor to a certain other classical music forum, always willing to share your vast experience and knowledge, and where your love of classical music always shines through. I am sure that many of us were delighted to see that you had joined 'unsung composers'.
Blushes :-[
Quote from: semloh on Tuesday 20 September 2011, 17:27I am sure that many of us were delighted to see that [Dundonnell] had joined 'unsung composers'.
Hear, hear - in advocating the cause of 'unsung' composers the keys are knowledge and enthusiasm (and a willingness to 'go it alone' if necessary), and these are clearly attributes that our recently-joined colleague has in spades.
;D
Instead of arguing about who was the reigning monarch when they produced their most important works, let's just call them British post-Brahmsian romantics.
there is sometimes some merit in related arguments, I think, or in their detritus (I think I do mean that word- or a related one...) - as when people argue over whether Beethoven was, on the whole, Classical or Romantic... (a logician might suggest that the argument just suggests that the adjective is being applied at the wrong granularity. Or something. Just as philosopher Wittgenstein discussed meaning at sentence level, but not at word level; one notes that it would not make much sense to discuss it at letter or phoneme(?) level, in many languages anyway.)
I listened today -in the car actually- to the new Hyperion coupling of the Cowen Piano Concertstuck and the Somervell Piano Concerto 'Highland' and Normandy Variations.
I am always (I hope ;D) more than happy to admit when I am wrong about music :) I confess to expecting some subfusc, sepia-tintented, cobwebbed relics from the tailend of the 19th century/beginning of the 20th which would confirm my expectations.
I was more than pleasantly surprised, indeed delighted to hear three such vibrant, tuneful and such confident pieces. Had tremendous fun listening to them and found myself tapping along on the steering-wheel(wretched bad practice, I know ;D), particularly to the Highland Concerto. (Helps being Scottish myself, I suppose :)
Quote from: Dundonnell on Thursday 22 September 2011, 00:21
... found myself tapping along on the steering-wheel(wretched bad practice, I know ;D), particularly to the Highland Concerto. (Helps being Scottish myself, I suppose :)
Some bagpipes would have nicely rounded off the experience though! (ok - won't go back there again!) ;D ;D I think you missed our exchanges on that subject Dundonnell!
In lieu of a decent orchestral recording (I do a good line in Marco Polo coasters for very hot drinks) here is Cowen's Concert Overture The Butterfly's Ball (1901) most beautifully rendered by a pianola ("Look Ma, no hands!") -
http://www.mediafire.com/?xauyvcl6n0travh (http://www.mediafire.com/?xauyvcl6n0travh)
;D
I am very keen to hear some more Cowen. While I agree that there are thin moments in the symphonies I've heard (ie 3&6), there is much that's beautiful in them, especially in the 6th. I bought that disc to hear the Coleridge-Taylor, but ended up listening far more to the Cowen. It would be good to hear the 4th and 5th. Personally I find Parry's symphonies a lot duller, apart from the 5th, though I love all of Stanford's.
I pretty much agree with all that you say (including your comments on the symphonies of Parry and Stanford) but I do find that Cowen's symphonies tend to run out of steam. The 6th is a more convincing work than the 3rd, but even it flaps around a bit in the finale. The best I have heard of him is the Concertstuck for Piano and Orchestra, recently released by Hyperion. That's a great piece.
Jimfin: <<Personally I find Parry's symphonies a lot duller, apart from the 5th, though I love all of Stanford's.>>
I can't possibly agree with you on the contrast between Cowen's and Parry's symphonies. Parry is a giant by comparison.
I hastily misread Jimfin's post! I was comparing Parry and Stanford's Alan. I do agree that Cowen is an also ran by comparison with those two, but I'd still like to hear more of his work and it does contain some lovely moments.
Sorry, Mark, I wasn't being very clear: it was Jimfin's post I was objecting to! I've now amended my last post to that effect...
Quote from: Jimfin on Thursday 03 November 2011, 00:30Personally I find Parry's symphonies a lot duller, apart from the 5th
Quote from: Alan Howe on Thursday 03 November 2011, 07:56I can't possibly agree with you on the contrast between Cowen's and Parry's symphonies. Parry is a giant by comparison.
I don't think that two these positions are mutually exclusive. Perhaps Jimfin was expressing an opinion as to what he would prefer to listen to rather than making a categorical judgement on the worth or otherwise of Parry (at least that was how I read it).
I find Bach duller than Vivaldi and listen to him out of duty rather than for pleasure, likewise I find Britten duller than Arnold but I'm absolutely convinced that the former in each case is the greater composer. Some find Bruckner dull, some (would you credit it) even find Tovey dull - to find something dull does not necessarily imply a negation of it's value but usually merely highlights a personal taste that others might or might not share.
Parry is certainly the greater musical thinker and at his best (as in the 5th Symphony, singled out for praise by Jimfin) reaches both a height of technique and a depth of emotion that still makes one wonder at his parochial reputation, but Cowen (with all his structural insecurity) is still the more original melodist and the better colourist.
:)
IMHO we haven't the (recorded) evidence to support the assertion that Cowen was the more original melodist.
Fair enough, given that so little actually has been performed within living memory.
:(
I can only judge from the piano, vocal and full scores that I have.
:)
I do agree about Cowen's gifts as a colourist. But I'm not convinced about his credentials as a symphonist, enjoyable as the ClassicO CD is: there are just too many pulled punches and too much meandering about for him to make much impact. I do like The Idyllic, though: it's a very nice listen.
Quote from: Alan Howe on Thursday 03 November 2011, 17:22I'm not convinced about his credentials as a symphonist [...] there are just too many pulled punches and too much meandering about for him to make much impact. I do like The Idyllic, though: it's a very nice listen.
This is a very fair assessment - it won't find any argument from me.
:)
Sorry, I may have cause some confusion. I think it's fairly obvious that both Parry and Stanford were considerably greater than Cowen appears to be, but yes, I do find Cowen's melody and the orchestration of the 6th more enchanting than many of Parry's symphonies, and I would like the chance to assess the 4th and 5th and get a decent recording of the 3rd as well. I cannot possibly make claims for Cowen on so little evidence, so I wasn't really comparing. But I do often find Parry a bit lifeless in his orchestral music, the Elegy for Brahms, the Overture to an Unwritten Tragedy. Among the Symphonies, no. 1 leaves me fairly cold, no. 3 is delightful but even Parry was reluctant to give it the title 'Symphony', no. 4 took a lot of revision to make it worthy, whereas I am pretty keen on all of Stanford's, which are full of life, thrust and colour, from the first onwards.
I think it's worth remembering that Cowen was a performed and praised symphonist before either Stanford and Parry, and the 'Scandinavian' had an international reputation. Its charm manages to shine through (just) even the ghastly Marco Polo performance.
depending on your score-reading ability, quite a few of Cowen's symphonic scores are available online, which is a start anyway...
Mm, my score-reading ability is pretty poor, unfortunately, and I don't even have a piano to aid me in my flat in Japan. I suppose I could have a go for the sake of the challenge!
Also now online is
Christopher J. Parker - The music of Sir Frederic Hymen Cowen (1852-1935) : a critical study. PhD (2007)
http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/1834/ (http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/1834/)
As with Duncan Barker's thesis on Mackenzie, this is the only recent study of any significance.
:)
This is great to have, thanks John.
With Christmas looming ever closer - what do you get for the unsung-music collector who has everything ...
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001DEGWMW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&m=A2YEGUIQ9JIOLY (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B001DEGWMW/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?ie=UTF8&m=A2YEGUIQ9JIOLY)
... the perfect stocking-filler.
;)
I've ordered one for Alan.
;D
Methinks you don't know how thin the ice is, upon which you are skating....
How very thoughtful. I trust there's a mouse to go with it to make my joy complete. Anyway, it'd make a good mat, preferably Cowen side down, for this much superior product...
http://scifigeektees.com/results/AK_Coburg/Felix_Draeseke_Stein/akcoburg.297637278 (http://scifigeektees.com/results/AK_Coburg/Felix_Draeseke_Stein/akcoburg.297637278)
;)
Dear Santa,
It's in the can...
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51UGghw9tVL._SL500_AA300_.jpg)
Make mine a LARGE one, please..
Will that baby hold a full British pint....????
Jerry
In addition to the piano score of the orchestral poem A Phantasy of Life and Love (1901) I have just uploaded the following works in (solo) piano transcriptions to IMSLP -
In Fairyland, Suite de Ballet (1896)
A Suite of Old English Dances (1905)
Cowen has been doing well at IMSLP recently, with Saint Ursula (1881), Ruth (1887), The Dream of Endymion (1897) and the Ode to the Passions (1898) all uploaded in vocal score, together with the full score of Symphony No.6, The Idyllic (1897).
;D
Thought I would also add that IMSLP now has Cowen's autobiography from 1913 entitled My Art and My Friends.
http://imslp.org/wiki/My_Art_and_My_Friends_%28Cowen,_Frederic_Hymen%29 (http://imslp.org/wiki/My_Art_and_My_Friends_%28Cowen,_Frederic_Hymen%29)
Enjoy!
Cypressdome
I have uploaded Cowen's 1902 Coronation March (interesting to compare stylistically with the Mackenzie) and most of his Sketches for Piano (or Orchestra) The Months (1912) to IMSLP.
:)
The latter was published in four books of three pieces each and unfortunately I only have the first three books, so October to December are currently lacking.
:(
This is a pity as they are really attractive miniatures - does any member have access to a copy of Book IV (Novello, 1912) in order to complete the set?
???
Thanks, cypressdome, for the Cowen biography link. Very interesting stuff.
I have been browsing through Cowen's book and while it has some interesting moments, there's a rather strong whiff of Charlie Pooter about him, to my mind. ;) Ironically, he talks about Grossmith :o
How important did Cowen think he was exactly?
To be fair to him, perhaps his view of how important he was didn't differ too much from how important his contemporaries thought he was. Maybe it's only with the benefit of hindsight that the dislocation becomes clear. What doesn't help is that, in some places, his writing style comes uncomfortably close to Pooter's!
I rather liked his defence in his foreword of his persistent use of the first person singular pronoun throughout the book. I found that I had a lot of sympathy with what he wrote!
I think that Lionel's point about his self-importance reflecting the importance which his contemporaries bestowed upon him is a very fair one. If you look at British musical lexicons of the period you'll find that Cowen's name looms large.
I do look forward to the same surprise being expressed when someone reads Boulez' utterances a hundred years from now: "Did Boulez really think of himself as a major figure?"
I have now completed a series of uploads to IMSLP (marked below in blue): with the exception of one or two occasional pieces, all of Cowen's extant major choral works are now available in vocal score -
The Rose Maiden (1870)
The Corsair (1876)
Saint Ursula (1881)
Sleeping Beauty (1885)
Ruth (1887)
A Song of Thanksgiving (1888)
St. John's Eve (1889)
The Water-Lily (1892)
The Transfiguration (1895)
Ode to the Passions (1898)
John Gilpin (1904)
He Giveth His Beloved Sleep (1907)
The Veil (1910)
Hopefully, this might facilitate a wider and more informed reassessment of this important area of his output.
:)
Quote from: JimL on Sunday 06 June 2010, 02:19
Anyone who considers Mahler to be inadequate in his developmental and contrapuntal skills must have rocks in his head! Does anybody think that he spends more time in his massive movements exposing or reprising his materials?
I must confess I never meant to imply that Mahler's development and contrapuntal skills were inadequate, although I can clearly see that what I wrote could be interpreted this way! Of course, Mahler is not only a master of development, but of the whole compositional structural process, which clearly Cowen was not (nor generally was Gershwin), which is what I thought I was trying to say, evidently not eloquently enough! Apologies to any Mahler fans, of which I am one!
Quote from: albion on Thursday 01 March 2012, 16:24
I have now completed a series of uploads to IMSLP (marked below in blue): with the exception of one or two occasional pieces, all of Cowen's extant major choral works are now available in vocal score -
The Rose Maiden (1870)
The Corsair (1876)
Saint Ursula (1881)
Sleeping Beauty (1885)
Ruth (1887)
A Song of Thanksgiving (1888)
St. John's Eve (1889)
The Water-Lily (1892)
The Transfiguration (1895)
Ode to the Passions (1898)
John Gilpin (1904)
He Giveth His Beloved Sleep (1907)
The Veil (1910)
Hopefully, this might facilitate a wider and more informed reassessment of this important area of his output.
:)
Thanks for your efforts in this regard. Even though I have most of these scores the IMSLP resource is so useful to have them on the laptop!
Quote from: Lionel Harrsion on Thursday 02 February 2012, 12:07
I have been browsing through Cowen's book and while it has some interesting moments, there's a rather strong whiff of Charlie Pooter about him, to my mind. ;) Ironically, he talks about Grossmith :o
I think Cowen did feel that he had achieved something during his life. The fact that the nation awarded him a knighthood also indicates that some of the 'Establishment' thought so too. But, I think he also felt like an outsider, whether due to his Jewish beliefs, or the fact that he was never really at the centre of academia (despite some time at the Guildhall School of Music in his latter years). However, hindsight is always a wonderful thing and posterity has placed him into that area of obscurity from which he is never likely to escape. As I have said a few times, he did do a lot to get Elgar's music performed, and as such we ought to thank him for that. However, by promoting Elgar's works he probably showed up the weaknesses of his own! With the 100th anniversary of his autobiography this year, one can say that it did little to bolster his standing. He liked writing in an anecdotal style: see his biographies of Haydn, Mozart, Rossini and Mendelssohn and other articles such as 'Composers with Long Hair' and the book of music terms: 'Music as she is wrote' (trust me, his autobiography was not always totally helpful, when I was trying to write my Ph.D on his life and works!). These works have done little to demonstrate the talented musician that he undoubtedly was. But many would also say that about his music as well...
Quote from: Jimfin on Thursday 02 February 2012, 22:17
I do look forward to the same surprise being expressed when someone reads Boulez' utterances a hundred years from now: "Did Boulez really think of himself as a major figure?"
I always think, if a composer doesn't blow his or her own trumpet, who else is going to?! Regardless of a composer's talent, if they don't believe in themselves, the chances are that others are not going to do so. Boulez certainly had a high opinion of himself and as part of that generation of modernists perhaps he deserves some credit, but was he a major figure...well...
Quote from: Mark Thomas on Thursday 02 February 2012, 18:20
I rather liked his defence in his foreword of his persistent use of the first person singular pronoun throughout the book. I found that I had a lot of sympathy with what he wrote!
I think that Lionel's point about his self-importance reflecting the importance which his contemporaries bestowed upon him is a very fair one. If you look at British musical lexicons of the period you'll find that Cowen's name looms large.
How true. Cowen's name does crop up a lot until about the turn of the First World War and then he rapidly disappears from practically any musical reference book of note, almost as though he had never existed! By the thirties, and before he had even been delivered to his grave, his name rarely gets a mention in any contemporary book about British music!
Quote from: albion on Sunday 06 November 2011, 23:58
Also now online is
Christopher J. Parker - The music of Sir Frederic Hymen Cowen (1852-1935) : a critical study. PhD (2007)
http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/1834/ (http://etheses.dur.ac.uk/1834/)
As with Duncan Barker's thesis on Mackenzie, this is the only recent study of any significance.
:)
Perhaps I am biased, but I do recommend a read of this!
Yes, I am with Albion on this one...'The Five', obviously not the 'Mighty Handful'!, are Sullivan, MacKenzie, Cowen, Parry and Stanford: these are the flag-bearers of the British Victorian musical period...
Quote from: albion on Monday 19 September 2011, 18:20
Quote from: Albion on Tuesday 30 November 2010, 05:07
With regard to the full score of Cowen's Concertstuck on IMSLP, pages 34 and 35 contain seven bars into which a piano part has been handwritten. Admittedly it is only a very brief passage (of unknown provenance), but it may be of interest to the relevant person at Hyperion!
Those seven bars of piano solo do make it into the new Hyperion recording! I emailed Hyperion suggesting some further orchestral works by Cowen which would be worth investigating and Simon Perry has passed these on to Martyn Brabbins who is going to have a look through the full scores. I realise that I'm probably in a minority of one in finding this quite exciting ...
;D
I would like to join this minority!
Quote from: giles.enders on Monday 21 June 2010, 12:34
Slightly off the topic, If any one is interested in Cowen's grave it is in the Jewish Cemetary in Golders Green< London. This was not his 'birth' name and strangely he was born in Jamaica and brought to London as a child.
Giles Enders
Cowen died on 6 October 1935, of Myocarditis at 105 Maida Vale, London, aged 83. He was buried at Golders Green Jewish Cemetery, which is divided into both Orthodox and Liberal sections. His grave, in the Liberal section at Row 48, Grave No. 3, is in a poor state of repair; the headstone is engraved 'IN LOVING MEMORY OF FREDERIC HYMEN COWEN, KT, MUSDOC, CANTAB, EDIN, BORN KINGSTON, JAMAICA, JAN 29TH 1852, DIED IN LONDON OCTOBER 6TH 1935'.
and as a teacher and an organizer of a school etc., Boulez was (was? when did he die again?). As a composer,...
then again, the same future generations will look on me with folly for all my over-hasty judgments too, not that I intend to stop making them with that in mind...
QuoteBoulez was (was? when did he die again?)
He hasn't. But back to Cowen...
I gather from the BBC that Martin Yates and the BBCCO recorded the Fifth Symphony in the summer of 2006, but in true BBC style it hasn't been aired yet. Maybe we should email the BBC and remind them that they haven't aired something that may be of interest! It wasn't a Dutton project apparently, it was a Radio Three project. Maybe if anyone is in touch with Martin Yates they should remind him of this symphony and see if he is interested in putting it into his next English Music Festival Programme.
@Christopher Parker - I think you are entitled to bias having produced a well-argued thesis about a (today) fairly shadowy figure from Victorian English music. Although I have read only around 20% of the text so far (not just the biography though) it is obvious you treat the composer objectively and with insight. Thank you for making the link to your work available. I cannot say I have been thrilled by Cowen's two recorded symphonies, but better presentation would surely help as I find neither the Marco Polo (which is pretty dire) nor the Classico (which is just a bit bland) very convincing. Maybe the "Idyllic" can't do any better than the decent Bostock recording and it is truly "bland" but a bit of the Jarvi/Chandos treatment might just change my mind. Thankfully (?) Neeme seems too tied up with Raff and Atterberg, and Cowen is just a bit TOO unsung :-D
I'm not (yet) convinced about Cowen. We need some more (and better) recordings...
Quote from: musiclover on Monday 14 October 2013, 11:13
in true BBC style it hasn't been aired yet.
Surely Unsung Composers' influence is strong enough to get Guardian/Snowden to release these secret BBC files?
A charitable thought, Paul, but I'm not sure that UC has any influence whatsoever. One or two of us here might, in certain quarters, but not with the BBC itself, as far as I'm aware.
Nobody with any musical sense has much influence with the BBC these days! Though Roger Wright is an influence for good at Radio 3.
Mr Wright didn't appear to be interested when I suggested celebrating Franz Lachner's bicentenary to him back in 2002.
I only know Cowen through his symphony 6 led by Bostock. I found an engaging and original voice in it. Not unlike Chadwick. Yes, we need more and better recordings.
Yes, I fully agree. All I know is the Marco Polo disc, which includes the 3rd Symphony, but we really do need more... How often we say this!
I must say that I get a bit frustrated when I see the most obscure, run-of-the-mill early European baroque composers getting significant CD coverage when there are so many undeservedly Unsung Composers. I suppose it's just easier and cheaper to produce CDs of Tortellini's Op.5, Op.6, Op.12 sets of Trio Sonatas (!) than a CD of a Cowen Symphony! ;D
I think that by far the best recorded Cowen piece (both the music and the performance) is the Hyperion recording of his Concertstuck for Piano and Orchestra (coupled with Somervell's Highland Concerto) on Hyperion.
Tortellini?
(Or Marcello cello sonatas?)
Having greatly enjoyed the Marco Polo recording of his 3rd symphony for a number of years, I was rather disappointed with Cowen's 6th symphony when it was issued on CD under the Classico label. I reckon the symphony by the youthful Coleridge-Taylor was much superior.
However, I note that Musikproduktion Hoflich now include his 4th symphony in their Repertoire Explorer series of study scores, so maybe some enterprising record company will get this one recorded if we wait long enough.
Depends on the availability of the parts. Takes awhile to make a new set from scratch... (er- never mind! see below.)
I see though that his "Cambridge" (5th) symphony in F -is- available in score and parts at the Fleisher Collection of the Free Library of Philadelphia, and presumably at least almost ready (depending on their readability) for performance. Likewise a few other works of his, I think... (I rather like that collection. And they answered a question of mine (about symphonies by Buttner and Butting...), as they have for others, very quickly indeed.)
(Hey, so's the 4th ("Welsh") symphony (Call no. 2044 Entire Work, 88 page (published, not manuscript) Novello score and parts, etc. I withdraw my objection. :) :) )
Quote from: eschiss1 on Friday 25 October 2013, 10:17
Tortellini?
(Or Marcello cello sonatas?)
Yes, "Tortellini" could serve as Marcello or any number of far less talented composers, in my view.
I've only ever heard Cowen's 3rd symphony, and I'd love to hear the 4th and 5th. Their names alone are inviting, at least to my traditional English ear - located as I am out here in the far-flung colonies! ;D!
Quote from: bulleid_pacific on Wednesday 16 October 2013, 20:13
@Christopher Parker - I think you are entitled to bias having produced a well-argued thesis about a (today) fairly shadowy figure from Victorian English music. Although I have read only around 20% of the text so far (not just the biography though) it is obvious you treat the composer objectively and with insight.
The thesis was a labour of love over 6 years and I tried to be as objective as I could. I remain hopeful that more of Cowen's music will get an airing by top-notch orchestras and conductors at some point in the future, as I am convinced there are fine moments amongst some of the mediocrity that is there too! Then we will all be able to make much more aural evidence-based assessments, rather than having to rely on playing through the scores on the piano, listening to not necessarily first rate recordings on, or relying on Sibelius computer software to give us an impression...
Quote from: Jimfin on Friday 25 October 2013, 05:39
I think that by far the best recorded Cowen piece (both the music and the performance) is the Hyperion recording of his Concertstuck for Piano and Orchestra (coupled with Somervell's Highland Concerto) on Hyperion.
Indeed, a much better recording than the 'Scandinavian' or 'Idyllic' (I don't have too many issues with the 'Idyllic' though).
Quote from: semloh on Monday 28 October 2013, 10:11
Quote from: eschiss1 on Friday 25 October 2013, 10:17
Tortellini?
(Or Marcello cello sonatas?)
Yes, "Tortellini" could serve as Marcello or any number of far less talented composers, in my view.
I've only ever heard Cowen's 3rd symphony, and I'd love to hear the 4th and 5th. Their names alone are inviting, at least to my traditional English ear - located as I am out here in the far-flung colonies! ;D!
There is quite a lot of people that share your view on this...
What, that Marcello was allegedly un(der)talented? (??? The work most people know by him is an oboe concerto by his less-talented brother; I gather his magnum opus, a very diverse set of psalm settings, is a very different beast to _that_...- unless one's just allergic to Baroque music as people here are more allergic, it seems, to "Modern music" than they are to _bad_ music, but that's another, if rather the crux, of the matter...)
Anyhow, no, I don't quite follow, I guess... though more, well-performed, Cowen would be welcome (and even more so certain other ccontemporaries, but this is a Cowen thread, so mooooven on...)