Contrary to reports which suggested that the conductor was to be Israel Yinon, cpo are bringing these out with Howard Griffiths conducting the Brandenburg State Orchestra of Frankfurt (Oder). Details here:
https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/cpo/detail/-/art/salomon-jadassohn-symphonien-nr-1-4/hnum/6800366 (https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/cpo/detail/-/art/salomon-jadassohn-symphonien-nr-1-4/hnum/6800366)
What a pity!
Maybe. But Griffiths is a very fine conductor, especially in the early romantic repertoire. And I'm just grateful that we're finally going to hear this music...
And I see that we have the two lovely cavatinas for violin and cello and orchestra respectively as fillers. Oh joy!
Among Griffiths' achievements are his magnificent Ries and Spohr symphonies cycles and excellent recordings of works by composers such as Wranicky, Wilms, Holbrooke, Cherubini and Danzi. If his Spohr cycle is anything to go by, he should be well equipped to tackle the classical-romantic idiom of Jadassohn: the Spohr symphonies are magnificently played, combining alertness with an appropriate weight which never undersells these works.
I certainly agree with your assessment of Howard Griffiths. And am very pleased his Spohr cycle for CPO is now complete.
I'm certainly glad to see some "official" word on release date and info. I'm fine with Griffiths. I've not been unhappy with anything he has done. His Spohr cycle is really good. Thanks for the update Alan! :)
Kevin
I am fine with Griffiths too, who is a perfect craftman - but Yinon is a more inspired conductor, able to give his performances more dimensions.
It could be that Jadassohn's tuneful classicism will respond better to craftsmanship rather than inspiration, but I agree that Yinon offers the latter - in spades.
Favor to ask- will someone who acquires this set (advertised for issue in Germany ca. 23 February, yay!) be willing to post the listed movements of symphony no.4 for the curious? (Assuming that there is anything besides "movement 1, movement 2, movement 3, finale" or whathave, etc.- sometimes cpo does let one down- rarely- in this connection...)
;^) (not just because we have an upload of the work, but-well, ok, just selfishly, in my case, and for myself, I've seen no.2- I should try to borrow it again and scan or typeset it at some point up to IMSLP, at that , if I can anyway... - and nos.1 and 3 are available there (in some form). :) )
... That's the same symphony as Bruns conducted, come to think of it, last year (in #4) in 2014 (Frankfurt/Brandenburg). Interesting to compare Griffiths' timing(s) with Bruns'...
My copy's on its way from Germany. Still no audio samples at jpc...
Update: audio samples from one of the CDs are now at jpc:
https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/cpo/detail/-/art/salomon-jadassohn-symphonien-nr-1-4/hnum/6800366 (https://www.jpc.de/jpcng/cpo/detail/-/art/salomon-jadassohn-symphonien-nr-1-4/hnum/6800366)
I think one can sense even from the brief audio samples at jpc that this set will radically change our perception of Jadassohn's symphonies, making, for example, the existing performance of No.1 on Cameo Classics seem earthbound and anaemic (as well as very poorly played) by comparison. The composer will, I am sure, emerge as a much more vital and individual composer than one might hitherto have suspected.
As far as I can tell, these are the details of the four symphonies:
Symphony 1 in C major, Op.24 (1861)
Symphony 2 in A major, Op.28 (1865)
Symphony 3 in D minor, Op.50 (1876)
Symphony 4 in C minor, Op.101 (1889)
Interestingly, then, Nos. 1 and 2 pre-date Brahms' 1st, No.3 is contemporary with that great masterpiece, and No.4 post-dates Brahms' 4th.
These sound bites are certainly enticing. How lucky we are to be able to hear these works at last, in what have every prospect of being excellent interpretations. We really are living through a golden age for recordings of unsung music, aren't we?
I agree entirely. We are so lucky. These symphonies are truly delightful works. I have been waiting to hear them for years. As we often say of such works - their neglect is extraordinary.
I certainly will look forward what Alan and Gareth think of this fine set. I'm intrigued.
Tom
The CPO 2 CDs set also includes
◦Cavatine Op. 69 für Violine & Orchester
◦Cavatine Op. 120 für Cello & Orchester
Klaudyna Schulze-Broniewska, Violin
Thomas Georgi, Cello
...great to have these too!
Yes. I mentioned these works earlier in the thread. They are both beautiful.
Anybody get the CD yet with the 4th Symphony?
It's still in transit.
I have just listened to the sound bites on Jpc.de - very impressive. I have just placed my order. Thankc UC for the recommendation.
This'll be one of my picks of 2015, without doubt. The music is unfailingly pleasing, beautifully orchestrated and occasionally surprisingly powerful - try, for example, the slow movement of No.2. Of course, this is not music of the depth of Brahms, but frankly who cares? This is predominantly heart-easing, satisfying music by a master-composer - a relatively minor master, maybe, but a master all the same.
Howard Griffiths' approach is of the 'classical, but not clinical' variety familiar, say, from Riccardo Chailly's much-lauded recent set of Brahms symphonies. I am pretty sure that Israel Yinon would have made more of the inherent romanticism of these symphonies, but Griffiths never over-inflates them, giving them wonderful spirit and drive, while ensuring that passages that require greater intensity of expression are given their full due.
For Eric and Jim, here are details of the movements of Symphony No.4:
1. Allegro patetico
2. Scherzo: Vivo
3. Adagio affetuoso
4. Finale: Allegro decido
By the way, the extremely vigorous performance of No.4 will come as quite a surprise to those who have become accustomed to the more languid reading of, say, Yinon. It's a bit like comparing Järvi in Raff to previous interpreters...
Actually, I suspect that Griffiths' one miscalculation may well be his performance of the slow movement of No.4 - hardly Adagio, as marked, I'd say. More like a swiftish Andante. But maybe I'm just plain wrong in my expectation of 19th century performance practice here.
Thanks! (decido looks like it should be "deciso"! :) )
Quite likely - it's not the only proofreading error.
At least Affetuoso is a common error for what I gather is supposed to be Affettuoso, or something. Anyhow, looking forward to hearing the set myself; have been curious, I think, to hear all 4 since having a look at the score of no.2 awhile ago (and increasing acquaintance with his music since).
....all these composers with names I don't recognize, and thus I kinda gloss over them. I was just listening to the upload and made a post in the other thread about it, and here we are a different thread talking about the release which was in the other thread of an unknown date.
Wierd coincidences abound...
Remember, Alan, my earlier warnings about Griffiths :-)
Well, it's swings and roundabouts, Adriano. Griffiths gets almost everything right - not bad, especially when there's no performing tradition. I think we can be grateful for the set while being grateful for what we have of Yinon's performance (which could be criticised for a certain lack of sharpness and vitality in the faster music, although he gets the slow movement right).
I recall a review in Fanfare ages ago criticizing Griffiths (on a Novalis CD? (maybe that with one of Gaspard Fritz' symphonies?)) for something similar. As to performance traditions and speeds of Adagios, I'm reminded of something Walker claims in the 2nd volume of his Liszt biography, maybe best summarized (or - maybe not...) - as this having been a matter of debate, not consensus. Least charitably though it seems to be a particularly late 20th/21st century of performing Romantic music (and much earlier music, flattening out the difference between andantino, andante, adagio, adagietto, into one uniform Slowish, to paraphrase one probably understandably discontented reviewer.)
It's actually fascinating to compare Jürgen Bruns' performance of Jadassohn 4 with Howard Griffiths'. Bruns is much more flexible in his approach (not to say slower), whereas Griffiths is much straighter and more rhythmic. Thus Griffiths is absolutely terrific in the stormier passages of the first movement, whereas Bruns makes far more of the yearning phrases of the opening (which with Griffiths go for almost nothing, being too 'clipped'). Griffiths also handles the coda more excitingly, whereas with Bruns (and Yinon) there is a feeling of 'drift'.
Clearly, we haven't had an absolutely top-flight performance yet. We need another recording...
There seems to be a slow introduction to the first movement of the 4th Symphony (that also returns at the end of the movement). Is this indicated in the liner notes? Is it an 'in tempo' introduction that achieves its apparent slower tempo through extended note values?
Quote from: Alan Howe on Wednesday 04 March 2015, 09:30
It's actually fascinating to compare Jürgen Bruns' performance of Jadassohn 4 with Howard Griffiths'. Bruns is much more flexible in his approach (not to say slower), whereas Griffiths is much straighter and more rhythmic. Thus Griffiths is absolutely terrific in the stormier passages of the first movement, whereas Bruns makes far more of the yearning phrases of the opening (which with Griffiths go for almost nothing, being too 'clipped'). Griffiths also handles the coda more excitingly, whereas with Bruns (and Yinon) there is a feeling of 'drift'.
Clearly, we haven't had an absolutely top-flight performance yet. We need another recording...
Does that mean wait?
Tom
No! Buy! And if another recording comes out, buy that too!
Re JimL: good question... Best answered, I think, if someone in London who --- like us --- has interest would stop by St Pancras library (I think?) and ask if they could take a look at their copy of the 4th symphony score and mark down as much extra info about it as they can :) (unless even that, not just asking for a digital copy, costs a fair amount of extra money...)
I notice a mention here of the absence of sound samples at the cpo site. They're up now (yay!)
Are you sure about that, Eric? The only score I can find listed on Worldcat is in the Newberry Library, Chicago, so maybe next time you're in the area...? Also the St Pancras library is actually the British Library and "stopping by" isn't so simple.
It's OK. The Jadassohn 4th is in the BL and I am a reader there, so next time I'm in London, which may not be for a few weeks, I'll try to drop in.
@Alan & JimL
Just listened to the Jadassohn cpo set, which is quite good. At last we have these works on CD. In my opinion, though, most of it could be played a bit lighter and Mendelssohn-like. Suppose Griffiths takes a bit a too fast tempo in the Fourth's third movement in order to stay within the time limit of a CD :-). But it is a respectful Adagio within the correct Metronome range. Of this Adagio affettuoso, one could make, for example a kind of semi-sad funeral march :-) Griffith just conducts as visualized in the booklet's photograph of him.
Liner notes do mention the 4th slow introduction, but not the track titles, which they would deserve.
Matesic- apologies several ways for my ignorance, which you have rightly parodied/sent up. I'll just hang a left at the corner + 1084-odd kilometers + around the block over to Newberry Library tomorrow ;^)
If you would be so kind, Gareth, that would be rightly much appreciated!
Not sure how soon that will be, Jim, but I'll do my best.
just received my copy of the symphonies.
Tom :)
Did you go to London, Gareth? And if so, did you remember to look up the Jadassohn 4th?
Haven't been yet, Jim.
As already mentioned earlier, in my own collection I have a first edition score of Jadassohn's Fourth.
I have now scanned all 150 pages and put them together into a sharp PDF file, but without polishing them and transforming them into a "print like" pure black-and-white format without grey background. Further polishing and editing requires hours and hours of work; it needed enough time already to make these clear scans and to edit them as they appear (the original paper color has become beige-brown over all these years). A color version would be better readable than a "simple click" black-and-white bulk version. And there are some blue pencil remarks by the conductor who owned the score oroginally. My scan is a 284 MB thing, so let me know if this is OK and where I can upload it.
Incidentally, I also have the original score of Jadassohn's Symphony Nr. 3...
Folks,
just FYI (and apologies if this post duplicates anything earlier in this thread!)
Have just noticed that Presto Classical have a pre-release (UK) offer of the 4 Jadassohn symphonies by CPO for just under £20 (+ postage - ca. £1.50) and it's some £5 cheaper if you just want to download them without the notes. Mine's now on order so I am looking forward to their arrival.
When I checked, the earlier JPC release seemed somewhat pricier (but I may well have missed their own special offer - c'est la guerre!)
Cheers
Richard
Well, Adriano, if you have the 4th, perhaps you could spare Gareth a trip to the library in London and simply answer the question - is there a slow introduction to the first movement, and if so, what is the tempo? Or is the beginning just an in-tempo introduction with extended note-values giving the impression of a slow intro?
If you would be so good as to answer JimL's question, Adriano, I'm sure all of us would be eternally grateful...
I think we have a first-edition score of symphony 3 uploaded to IMSLP (via BSB maybe?), but I may be mistaken. That said, 2nding Alan's 21:29 response with curiosity :)
Hi there and sorry for replying with some delay.
There are 16 bars "Sostenuto" in 4/4 at the beginning of the first - and 19 bars "Sostenuto" at the beginning of the last movement. Then follow "Allegro patetico un poco agitato" in 6/4 - and "Allegro decido" alla breve respectively. This "decido" must be a printing mistake in the score, since in Italian one says "deciso".
Of course, "Sostenuto" can be taken as slow and I suppose other conductors would make of these two introductions real introductory Adagios.
And, as I have already mentioned once, Griffith's second movement is all other than an "Adagio affettuoso", it's a boisterous march - but it works and may be less boring that in a slower tempo.
In cpo's tracklist (in both, the 1st and 4th mouvement!), the "Sostenuti" are missing - but, of course, not in the music.
Alan, do you agree with me that the harp is, unfortunately - and thoroughly - almost unheard??
As far as my offer is concerned, if there is enough interest, my scan is finished and I could upload the whole score. I've also made a reduced file version of 30MB vs. the original sharp scan of 288 MB. The quality is just a bit inferior.
Why not upload it to IMSLP so the general public can enjoy it?
No, I would prefer only on UC. I do not agree with IMSLP, since they also publish scores which are still protected.
not scores which are protected _everywhere_, just under certain jurisdictions but not others.
I just received my copy of the Jadassohn symphonies from cpo. There was mention made of some books he wrote. Has anyone read them? He seemed to have studied with Liszt at the same time that Raff worked for him. So far my impression of the 4th symphony (2 listens) is it is very well structured and quite listenable. It is a shame that his music disappeared so quickly after his death because he does have something to offer.
Tom :)
We are substantially the richer for now being able to hear Jadassohn's four symphonies. The Fourth is a work of real substance, red-bloodedly dramatic in places but unfailing lyrical, and with many piquant details of orchestration. Although the sensibility is clearly based in the Leipzig school, this is no dry academic exercise and, as I have got to know the piece, I've found it quite a thrilling listen. It's three predecessors show a clear progression from the charming, comparatively light, No.1 to the more weighty No.3. The slow movements in particular develop a real depth of feeling with each successive work as Jadassohn's own individual sound world develops. Although the seriousness of purpose of each symphony is deeper than the one before, each work is a hugely pleasurable listen. Although stylistically a very different composer to Raff, Jadassohn's symphonies exhibit the same sheer cleverness and dexterity in orchestration, the same strong melodic identity and the same propulsive forward momentum as Raff's. Each of the two concertante Cavatinas is, by the way, charm on a stick too. What's not to like? Thoroughly recommended.
I plan on listening to them today. The allegro vivace in the second symphony is quite compelling. I wish that CPO could avoid some of the mistakes such as timings not adding up. Hopefully some of you will have read some of his books.
Tom :)
Some of Jadassohn's (quite a few) books have been digitized etc.; I've skimmed some of those but haven't really read them yet.
I saw them at Barnes and Noble but you have to have a Nook device to get them. Very frustrating.
Tom :(
I was able to have a bit of a read and discovered that they're not for me at all.
Tom :)
Really? Given the background they could contribute to some of your reviews of music by him and his pupils (and of composers who were brought up learning music around the same time), I'd think that they could be very useful, historically. Unless that's precisely what you're saying, that you know all of this already, to a T, and tried some of Jadassohn's exercises and solved them rapidly...
Tom, if you have an ipad or other tablet, you can download the Nook app free. Same is true of the Kindle software. If that helps.....
Jerry
I don't. I'm looking into getting the Kindle replaced.
Tom :)
BTW the score and parts of symphony no.2 (the one I've been familiar with the longest, wrote a brief thing about for netnews years ago) are now available @ IMSLP (http://imslp.org/wiki/Symphony_No.2,_Op.28_(Jadassohn,_Salomon)) - thanks, Cypressdome (and the NYPO Digital Archives.)
Just listened to Symphony No. 1.... I find a fascinating shadow of Berwald's Symphony No. 2 - Capricieuse's 1st movement in the 1st movement of this Symphony in many places - The quirky harmonic shifts and deft orchestration. All in all, a thoroughly enjoyable romp!
Finally got this set and I have to say, it's fantastic all around. It's a sign of a good composer when I can hum along to something I've never heard before.
Big thumbs up from me.
QuoteIt's a sign of a good composer when I can hum along to something I've never heard before
That's a good summary of Jadassohn's prime virtue as a composer.
For me, that's part of Jadassohn's problem - it's too congenial. I miss the drama, mystery, the storm and stress that truly top-notch composers bring to the concert hall. Jadassohn is just too nice. They're pleasant enough, but no masterworks. And yet, wouldn't these symphonies make wonderful additions to the repertoire of community/amateur orchestras? I was especially taken with the 4th, which alas is not on IMSLP.
Quoteit's too congenial
Yes, I understand that too. I think No.4 might be a bit of an exception - but it needs a rather weightier approach than Griffiths offers to bring out the potential scale and reach of the piece.
Now reviewed by Dave Hurwitz, no less:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVvkP5oYLII
...and he gets them just about right.