Currently I'm discovering and exploring the 8 Symphonies of Hans Huber, an almost forgotten Swiss composer. I love his PC's 1 and especially 3, but I can strongly recommend his Symphonies as well (the complete set of 5 CD's is now available at jpc for €54 excl. p&p). Every symphony is a listening adventure, and has beautiful passages and themes, sometimes with a solo instrument like the violin. Some are immediately appealing, like the 1st and 2nd, others have to grow on me. His Symphonies (and PC's) remind me hardly of others. Now and then I'm thinking of a mixture between Strauss and Sibelius, but certainly not Brahms (he's mentioned many times in the booklets, of course).
I think Sterling has done us a great favour with the release of Huber's Symphonies and two PC's. I understand Huber als wrote a VC and CC. If the complete scores are still around, who knows what we can expect in the near future.
What is your opinion?
Oh dear. I'm afraid I find Huber's orchestral stuff rather a bore. His earlier music is his best, I think, but I just find that there's too much hearty beer and Swiss cheese in most of the symphonies. The Sterling performances make a good case for the music, but I'm not convinced...
Time for me to give the symphonies another listen, maybe?
There's also a lot of chamber music (mentioned by William Newman, some of it, in The Sonata Since Beethoven...) - some of it recorded (one of the piano quartets on LP, one of the piano quintets I think, one of the cello sonatas, but not too much more?) Again IMSLP has a lot of the scores.
Eric
I've clearly missed out on the hearty beer and Swiss cheese in the Huber symphonies. For in them I find lots of buzzing energy that's not too far away from Dvorak and Elgar, and which I've never found in beer and cheese! Peter is also surely right to mention Sibelius and Strauss. To be sure, Huber isn't the complete master of the orchestra (I don't find myself gasping at the audacity and novelty of the orchestral writing in the way I do with the striking sound of Sibelius; nor glow with sheer pleasure at Strauss at his best [or being especially slick in the way only he can do]). But there is a firm grasp and control of formal development & progression of ideas in Huber that makes him a far superior composer than say Fritz Brun whose symphonies, despite some marvellous passages, often get bogged down in a wallow. So push to one side, Alan, the beer and cheese, and have another go at Huber. I find him a most satisfying composer and have been glad to discover his music - and hats off to Bo Hyttner for giving us excellent recordings of the symphonies. Wish we could hear more of the music, though, and especially the chamber music.
Peter
Actually, I listened to most of Symphony No.1 yesterday and enjoyed it enormously - well up to, say, Stanford standards and very much 'Brahms plus' (nothing wrong with that!). On to No.2 today...
Thank you for your comments, Alan, Eric and Peter. Up to now I like the 2nd most of all, although the 1st and sunny 8th are very appealing as well. This morning I listened to the 4th, a curious work for strings, with a major role for a piano and very marginal role for an organ. Nevertheless I like the themes, although they are not that memorable. I have the impression that every symphony offers the listener something different. Interesting, but I cannot discover a typically Huber style.
I'm getting more and more impressed by his Piano Concertos. I'll guess the 3rd is the most interesting of the two, but the 1st offers hardly less memorable tunes. The 4th movement is a stunning finale. Just beautiful.
I wonder what the quality of Huber's chamber music is. Jpc offers two discs.
I have enjoyed 1 and 2, but No.3 already feels inflated beyond Huber's means - rather too much cod-Wagner for my liking - so already indigestion is replacing enthusiasm. Where on earth is the music going? I'm afraid I can't hear (so far) any Sibelius or Strauss - the idiom is much more conservative (nothing much beyond Smetana or Dvorak, and unfortunately without their tunes!)
I just don't find Huber particularly interesting, but recognise that it may well be my fault. The comparison with Brun is, I think, unfair: the latter really belongs to the generation after Huber - it's a bit like comparing Stanford with Bantock. Still, I listen on...
I've listened to the 3rd for the 3rd time, and it definitely grows on me. The Trauermarsch is a beautiful, slow movement with a certain depth. I like the entrance of the soprano in the Finale, but the contribution to the whole work is marginal. No Sibelius or Strauss in this symphony (hints of those much greater composers in the later symphonies), but, (don't laugh at me) in the opening movement I must think of Berlioz and Franck, only for just a moment. It's a curious range of symphonies, and some passages are spicy, just like Swiss cheese... :D
Moving my response from Martin Anderson's thread as it's more appropriate here ...
I'm guessing that the scores and parts of concerto 2 were only made available for hire, never as study scores (or else that somehow all those study scores were limited editions and lost, as has happened too- as when all radio tapes made of a broadcast, iirc, seem to have disappeared, or something like that...)
Always conceivable some real Huber-nut will try to reconstruct Huber concerto 4 from the reduction and the manuscript-remains as a labor of love, weirder things seem to be happening (I think I can think of examples.) And concerto 2's score's disappearance, judging from even a quick skim of that reduction, does seem to be a real pity - it seems a thematically enjoyable and rich concerto-in-G.
But yes, to that chamber music. (Oh, I wasn't aware of the trio disc on Acte Prealable with the sonata/trio op. 135 for two violins and piano. Missed that when summarizing the Huber chamber music recordings I knew of :) His organ fantasy on holy texts, in C minor, has been recorded once or twice; I know it from MIDIs I made. I like that too.)
Hrm, this should be moved to the Huber thread. Doing so.
Eric
How many concertos did he write? I have the trwo piano concertos 1 & 3.
Quote from: FBerwald on Friday 30 April 2010, 16:34
How many concertos did he write? I have the trwo piano concertos 1 & 3.
I believe there are 4 piano concertos (apparently no. 2 in G op.107, ca. 1891, is lost except for the 2-piano reduction and no. 4 in Bflat (pub. 1911) almost may as well be, too), a violin concerto and a cello concerto (I know nothing about those except that they are said to exist or have existed.)
Eric
I visit this site first time and for this reason i do not understand this topic Hans Huber . Please help me for understanding this.
Quote from: eschiss1 on Friday 30 April 2010, 16:51
Quote from: FBerwald on Friday 30 April 2010, 16:34
How many concertos did he write? I have the trwo piano concertos 1 & 3.
I believe there are 4 piano concertos (apparently no. 2 in G op.107, ca. 1891, is lost except for the 2-piano reduction and no. 4 in Bflat (pub. 1911) almost may as well be, too), a violin concerto and a cello concerto (I know nothing about those except that they are said to exist or have existed.)
Eric
I think I recall Bo Hyttner telling me that the Full score and orchestral material of the 2nd PC of Huber is missing and that although there is extant a MS of the 4th PC it is in very poor condition with many pages missing so that reconstruction would take a long time and cost a lot of money, which is why Sterling have made no attempt (and have no plans) to try to reconstruct and record PCs 2 & 4.
Re. disappearance of orchestral material, etc., the full score may never have been published and it would be quite usual for the orchestral parts to remain in MS, only the 2-piano score for pianists to practise being printed. Such MS items got lost regularly. A similar fate seems to have been suffered by Stavenhagen 2; Siboni; Moscheles 8 and numerous others. Quite often the composer made only a "short score" (i.e for solo instrument and piano, the orchestral parts being indicated in the 2nd piano part) and would conduct from this - so a full score was never, in fact, produced. This was the case with many concertos before about 1860.
Where MS material is concerned we are frequently dependent on the relatives of the composer for preserving his/her materials. Far too often they have been cavalier and careless with these precious items, sometimes deeming them of no worth and actually destroying them!
I don't know if the Cello Concerto exists still, but Bayerische Staatsbibliothek has a copy of the Piano/Violin score of the Violin Concerto Op. 40 (as, I believe has Library of Congress). The score was published by Schott of Leipzig in 1879 so that publishing house may have a copy in their archives. The 4th PC was published by Hug of Leipzig. As you know, so much wonderful music was lost in the bombing raids on that city in WWII.
Quote from: Gareth Vaughan on Saturday 01 May 2010, 14:52
....... A similar fate seems to have been suffered by Stavenhagen 2; Siboni; Moscheles 8 and numerous others......
Dear Gareth could you shed some light on this "Siboni" please!??! I googled him with disastrous results.
Erik Anton Walsemar Siboni (1828-92) was a Danish composer of Italian extraction who wrote a big-boned Brahmsian piano concerto. Danacord had it earmarked for recording with Oleg Marshev - except they discovered the score and orchestral parts could not be found. Library of Congress has score and parts for a piano quartet of his (that's all) - would love to hear it.
What else has he written? Any web-sites dedicated to him?
The Siboni sounds interesting Gareth. It seems strange that Danacord had committed to a recording without the score in hand. I do not pretend to understand the mechanics of preparing to record, but isn't it like walking in to bat without the bat ? Surely the score exists somewhere, how else would they have decided to go with it ?
There are plenty of entries on the web and in books about Siboni. His music is said to be modelled on Mendelssohn.
He studied with Moscheles, Hauptman & Sechter, and wrote two symphonies, overtures,the piano concerto mentioned, string quartets, including a quartet for piano,violin, viola & cello op10, sonatas,trios, operas & choral works. From what I have read, he is a genuine unsung, and hopefully he will make the catalogue soon.
Marcus.
I didn't say Danacord had committed to a recording, merely that they had "earmarked" it, by which they meant it was on their shortlist of concertos to record. It's quite easy for a record company to list a concerto as being one they would like to record, but find later that the orchestral material no longer exists. This is because solo piano parts, or 2-piano scores, are usually available of such works since these were printed, even if the rest of the material remained in MS, and these are usually sufficient to make a judgement on the music's worth. (The Hartknoch Grand Concerto No. 2 which Hyperion wanted to record is a case in point - in fact, I am not infrequently asked to try to locate orchestral material for a concerto of which only the solo or 2-piano scores exist.) Perhaps rashly, Danacord posted a paragraph on their website when they began the series of Danish Romantic PCs with Oleg Marshev in which they wrote that listeners could look forward to concertos by... there followed a list of names (nearly all of whose PCs have indeed been recorded by Danacord) which included that of Siboni. When I later inquired about this work, they wrote rather sheepishly to tell me the orchestral material was lost. Perhaps they had been led to believe that the parts were in the publisher's archive, but a search failed to find them (this, I'm afraid, is the fate of Bazzini's VC no. 3 "Hymne Triomphale" - Schott thought they had the material but when asked for it could not find it - I suppose this is not too surprising if a work has not been performed for over 100 years!).
I fear this is moving off topic.
Siboni was important enough to make the short lists. Pratt's history (sec. 213) mentions three 19th-century Danes: Hartmann ("an admirer of Spohr"), Gade (whose "style reflected that of Mendelssohn at first, later that of Schumann"), and "Erik Siboni (d. 1892), at work in Copenhagen from 1853 ... with 2 symphonies, an overture and some chamber pieces, besides choral works and an opera (1862)" (essentially Marcus's list above). Sounds like Pratt hadn't actually heard any of this. Arthur Elson may have, though. His survey of mid-century Danes (p. 140) names Gade -- whom, he divulges, was called "Mrs Mendelssohn" (yes, and the same age dubbed Dittersdorf "Haydn's wife") -- and Siboni, "whose symphonies, choral works, and chamber music show Mendelssohn's influence". The same can be said superficially of Schumann's symphonies, choral works, and chamber music, of course. Might as well mention Beethoven's influence, too. The Royal Library in Copenhagen holds an opera, Othello, and a Stabat Mater plus a slew of teaching pieces for piano. But no symphonies, no 1864 concerto.
I've just done a little internet research and found that Siboni's MSS are held in the archive of the Danish National Lilbrary. The 1864 PC is listed but, alas, it is only the solo piano part (35 pages) - no symphonies, either. World Cat. has 59 entries (some duplicates, of course) for pieces by Siboni, held in various libraries (mostly Danish, it must be said).
Certainly interesting, but I'm almost sure Hans Huber has never heard of Siboni ;)
Over the past days I've been listening to Huber only. His symphonies are varying in memorability, but I'm quite enthusiastic about the nos. 1-4 and 8. However, his PC 1 is for me the most attractive piece of orchestral music. Definitely more appealing than his slightly complex, but certainly interesting 3rd. It's full of memorable and inventive tunes in all 4 movements. I'm increasingly convinced that Hyperion has missed an attractive edition of its RPC series, a coupling of two great and appealing PCs by two Swiss born composers...
Any other opinions on Huber's piano concertos?
Just one more time Huber. I'm now completely under the spell of Huber's 1st PC in C Minor, op. 36. What a gorgeous, brilliant masterpiece, full of memorable themes and with a 3rd movement, a sort of scherzo including a trio, which has not its equal. This is utterly sparkling music, full of energy. It has been a very long time that a work has, after repeated hearings, grown so much on me. If you don't know this marvellous PC, I can only strongly recommend it! Thank you, Sterling!
Now I have a provocative question to those who are already familiar with this concerto. If you listen to it, and imagine that you don't know the composer, you'll probably think it's written in the 1870s or 1880s. Suppose someone says to you, this is a recently discovered 2nd PC by Raff, would you believe it? I would. Please tell me that I'm totally wrong.
Apologies for opening this ancient thread, but I would like some updated comments from the well-qualified participants hereon, whose opinions I respect:
I just finished listening through all the Huber Symphonies. The overall impression is one of boredom, of stolid music, garnering little interest. I found myself glancing at the track timings to see how much longer the music would plod ahead. Yes, there are some novel touches - such as the recurring Theme & Variations aspects, and the quasi-concerto approach of the Fifth Symphony. However, the inspiration never arrived and I think I will sell off the CDs and make room for more exciting tunes.
Am I missing something? And if so, what is it?
(PS - The Piano Quintet and Piano Quartet are very much more appealing.)
which? there are two of each. (and a ton of other chamber music only a very little of which has reached recording. (Hansheinz Schneeberger, who's represented in my CD collection by a fine recording of Reger's last two violin sonatas, did record one of Huber's 2 piano quartets on LP, and also well...- the 2nd? Heard it at the local university library, need to look it up, will do so soon.)
...presumably the two recorded on Musiques Suisses (Piano Quintet No.1 and Piano Quartet No.2) - a lovely disc, by the way, and IMHO by far the best of Huber. As with many composers (e.g. Fuchs, Gernsheim, Kiel, etc.) the best of him may well be in his chamber music...
You presume correctly - I have the Musiques Suisses disc and, as noted above, agree on the relative quality of these chamber works vis-a-vis his symphonies.
I agree to a certain extent. My first enthusiasm of Huber's symphonies has drastically changed. I still like his first two symphonies, but from the Third they are indeed boring. After listening you ask yourself: what did I just hear? And why did I listen to this symphony again? Neither stunning, nor interesting. Except for the First and Second the other 3 CD's of Sterling's Huber Symphony collection belong to my growing batch of discs I never turn to again....
I have a completely different opinion about some other works by Huber. The Sterling disc with his PC's 1 & 3 is a real winner. Unbelievable that these marvellous concertos are from the same composer as those boring symphonies. And indeed, the Piano Quintet op. 111 and Piano Quartet op. 117 are lovely works as well. Then I also have a Pan Classics CD Präludien und Fugen in allen Tonarten für Pianoforte zu vier Händen, op. 100. The effort of listening once per year more than worthwhile, but I'm open to correction.
Quote from: Peter1953 on Thursday 28 April 2011, 11:27
Except for the First and Second the other 3 CD's of Sterling's Huber Symphony collection belong to my growing batch of discs I never turn to again....
I have gone a step further and offered all the symphony CDs for sale on Amazon.
I don't have the PC disc. Perhaps I'll give it a go.
Thanks for your response.
I have Symphonies 8 and 4.
I rated them not striking.
Reading the forum, i'll try again...
Just listen to the 2nd theme of the 1st movement of the 4th Symphony! Elgar, Vaughan Williams, or Holst speak to me! Yet in the 1st I hear Mendelssohn, and the 3rd...Anton Rubenstein! Such music! Huber is indeed unsung!
Well, I think that comparison's a bit of a stretch; but some of the sonorities may be similar in Huber's string-based 4th Symphony. In general I can't work up much enthusiasm for his symphonies - too bland by far for my taste. I think his best music lies elsewhere...
More than once in this thread there is a suggestion that maybe Huber's chamber music is what is mostly worth listening to. It got me to check out youtube once more for Huber works.
Turns out there are a large number of those newly posted by "bnm-medien" (http://www.bmn-medien.eu) (check it out--there are other unsung works in their repertoire). Among those posted are the piano quintets 1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7uyA_NIGYI) and 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9PSRETSFDI) (complete except the fourth movement of number 1), two cello sonatas here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCdAV2w1hXc&index=5&list=PLeLwTH8fmLxXnSrq6e0p83mGPt7Knqeuq) and here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nuwkpNGupzc) (possibly also not entirely complete), several piano trios and other stuff (sorry, no more links, I am too lazy).
The common element in all those recordings is the pianist Jan Schultsz who must have worked a monster assignment (and maybe was be the main driving force behind the effort).
So far I have listened to the two piano quintets (Schultsz and the Basler Streichquartett) and I am impressed. The piano dominates somewhat (Huber apparently wrote the part for himself to play) as it often does in this combination but the string parts are nonetheless well written and interesting to play, lovely solos for everyone, even for the second fiddler who often has a less than equal part in piano quintets (Schumann and Dvorak for example). The music is engaging and does not outlast its welcome and the playing is very good as well.
These recordings will probably be taken down by bmn-medien when they have served their function of promoting the recordings.
There is also a strange recording (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6YY2OS-PFs) of the sonata for two violins and piano which I like a lot less. This recording is bad: There are intonation problems in the violins, dynamics is monotone, hardly any piano, 90% forte, and the audience can be heard having conversations. It seemed rather unattractive as a composition but an interpretation on the level of the recordings above might just prove me wrong.
Professor Jan Schultsz (http://www.schultsz.com) is a fine musician and one of unsung music's good guys. He was the driving force behind several Raff recordings (piano quintets, piano quartets, piano trios and two song cycles) issued on the Divox label, and the series of YouTube videos is promoting his latest project: recording all Huber's chamber music for piano.
He is certainly a very impressive pianist on top his other merits!
These are some really lovely pieces in YouTube. However, there is an error with the postings there for the 4th Sonata for violoncello & piano B flat major, op.130. The first and last of the three movements appear to have been reversed - at least when one compares with the printed score as follows:
Mov. 1 Adagio con molto sentimento, ma non troppo lento
Mov. 2 Allegretto grazioso e umoristico
Mov. 3 Allegro molto con fuoco
The posting of those recordings appears to have been done in a rush. There are plenty of very obvious errors (like "Erster Quintett"). But the recordings themselves are excellent without exception .
Yes, 'Quintett' is neuter, so it should read 'erstes Quintett'.
Hans Huber's "Waldlieder" op. 117 is one of the most beautiful piano quartets I know. It's an ideal piece to commemorate this great Swiss composer on the 100th anniversary of his death.
While Huber's chamber music is excellent, I must also express my fondness for his Third Piano Concerto, which has for years been among my favorites in the genre.
In fact, I also quite like most of his symphonies, although it has taken me a very long time to genuinely appreciate them. For me personally, the trouble is that his strongest music is generally in the middle movements, and the weaker stuff is in the outer ones - so you can see why people lose their motivation. Oh, and it's probably best to forget about their programs with the exception of the Boecklin Symphony (No. 2); they don't seem to make much sense as program music.