Unsung Composers

The Music => Composers & Music => Topic started by: Dundonnell on Monday 10 October 2011, 22:57

Title: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Monday 10 October 2011, 22:57
The arrival this morning of an imported cd from the USA containing Walter Piston's Concerto for Orchestra-a piece I have been seeking for years-encouraged me to reflect on the number of Concertos for Orchestra actually composed.

Wikipedia supplies a list but it is incomplete.

So...I tried to make up one of my own ;D  * signifies those I have in my own collection.

(Qualifications: has to be called simply "Concerto for Orchestra"; no other title will qualify, although a 'sub-title' will do. Concertos for String Orchestra don't count. Nothing by Alan Hovhaness gets included because his Concertos are for different combinations of instruments. Cut-off date of 1981 arbitrarily imposed by me ;D)

1925: Paul Hindemith*
1930: Tadeusz Szeligowski*
1931: Gian Francesco Malipiero
1932: Alfredo Casella
1933: Mario Pilati*
1933: Walter Piston*
1934: Goffredo Petrassi No.1*
1938: Kurt Hessenberg No.1*
1939: Zoltan Kodaly*
1943: Bela Bartok*
1944: Morton Gould*
1951: Goffredo Petrassi No.2*
1953: Goffredo Petrassi No.3*
1954: Goffredo Petrassi No.4*
1954: Witold Lutoslawski*
1955: Goffredo Petrassi No.5*
1957: Kurt Hessenberg No.2
1957: Goffredo Petrassi No.6*
1961: Giya Kancheli
1962: Grazyna Bacewicz
1963: Sir Michael Tippett
1963: Rodion Shchedrin No.1 ("Naughty Limericks")*
1964: Havergal Brian*
1964: Goffredo Petrassi No.7*
1965: Roberto Gerhard*
1966: Viktor Kalabis*
1967: Robin Holloway No.1
1968: Thea Musgrave
1968: Rodion Shchedrin No.2 ("The Chimes")*
1969: Elliott Carter
1972: Goffredo Petrassi No.8*
1973: Sir Richard Rodney Bennett*
1974: Christian Darnton*
1974: Anthony Payne
1978: Herman D. Koppel*
1978: Robin Holloway No.2
1981: Roger Sessions*

No French Concertos for Orchestra? No Swedish, or Dutch, or Norwegian?

So.....go on any other compulsive list-makers. Who have I missed? ;D ;D
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: erato on Monday 10 October 2011, 23:17
Conrad Baden; konsert for orkester, 1968
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: erato on Monday 10 October 2011, 23:21
And Gunther Schuller, 1966.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Monday 10 October 2011, 23:25
Quote from: erato on Monday 10 October 2011, 23:17
Conrad Baden; konsert for orkester, 1968

Right, there's one Norwegian at least :)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 00:08
If the Roussel concert pour petit orchestre also doesn't count for the same reason that concertos for string orchestra don't...
(Erland von Koch also wrote a "concerto for small orchestra", composed 1955.)
There is Jacques Ibert's "Louisville-concert, pour orchestre" (published 1954) which is closer.
There's the Swiss Roger Vuataz's petit concert pour orchestre (op.39 - pub.1955?), too.
(Holmboe more or less wrote 3 concertos for orchestra as usually understood, but none is exactly called concerto for orchestra or the Danish translation thereof- one is Sinfonia concertante (1945), one is "Concerto Giocondo e Severo" (1977), one is "Trae, Messing og Tarm" (wood, brass and gut) (1946) (all will have to go in honorable mention so far as this list is concerned however :) ). There is a BIS CD coupling all three.)
There's a concerto for orchestra by Icelandic composer Jon Nordal (b.1926) published in the 1970s.

Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: semloh on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 00:31
I have:
1939 - Bernstein
1954 - Lutoslawski
1957 - Howard Swanson
1958-61 - Rota (aka Concerto Festivo)

And, Shchedrin wrote 5 between 1963 and 1998
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 00:49
I was being very deliberately precise regarding nomenclature because there are so many works which are, effectively, concertos for orchestra without being so called. The Ibert is a perfect example.

And mention of 'Louisville' recalls that Hilding Rosenberg's' Concerto No.3 is titled 'Louisville'. But then, are Rosenberg's four Concerti really Concertos for orchestra since two are for string orchestra and the other two for three or four solo instruments and orchestra. If we admit them do we admit Holmboe's Chamber Concertos?

I did consider the Nino Rota and was almost certainly unfair to leave it out. Swanson, yes, he joins Baden and Schuller :)

Surely Leonard Bernstein's Concerto for Orchestra dates from 1989 not 1939??
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: semloh on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 01:06
Quote from: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 00:49

Surely Leonard Bernstein's Concerto for Orchestra dates from 1989 not 1939??
Well, he was 21 by then and no doubt capable of writing it but yes, of course, 1989. New spectacles required? No, in all honesty, new brain! ;D
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Simon on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 02:33
I must add :

Mikhail Starokadomsky : Concerto for Orchestra, op.14 (1937), published by Shirmer (I mentioned this work previously in another post, yet Starokadomsky seems truly forgotten these days!).

Simon
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 04:43
Quote from: Simon on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 02:33
I must add :

Mikhail Starokadomsky : Concerto for Orchestra, op.14 (1937), published by Shirmer (I mentioned this work previously in another post, yet Starokadomsky seems truly forgotten these days!).

Simon

Absolutely a new name to me :)

So he must have been the first Russian composer to write a Concerto for Orchestra, over 20 years before Shchedrin?
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: alberto on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 09:13
Robin Holloway has reached Concerto for Orch. n.5 (premiered at the last Proms).
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Ilja on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 11:01
If the name's crucial, there's of course also Zelenka's Concerto à 8 Concertanti, which is often referred to as the 'Concerto for Orchestra'. That's from around 1700 so should be the first...
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:07
I can also now add Thomas Wilson's Concerto for Orchestra of 1967 because I am listening to it ;D
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Latvian on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:13
A few more candidates! Sorry, I don't have time to check dates to see if they are pre-1981...

Adaskin, M                   
Akses, NK                   
Berkeley, M                 
Danielpour, R               
Einem, G von                 
Estevez, A                   
Freedman, H                 
Gaubert, P                   
Glazachev, G                 
Gregson, E                   
Hajibeyov, S                 
Higdon, J                   
Higdon, J                   
Hoddinott, A                 
Hristoskov, P               
Kalnins, Im                 
Kardos, D                   
Kay, U                       
Kochan, G                   
Kyurkchiyski, K             
Lees, B                     
Lindberg, M                 
McCabe, J                   
Meulemans, A                 
Meyer, EH                   
Miyoshi, A                   
Pakhmutova, A               
Paulus, S                   
Raichev, A                   
Ran, S                       
Roxburgh, E                 
Ryan, J                     
Sagatov, M                   
Schurmann, G                 
Sicilianos, Y               
Slonimsky, S                 
Szervansky, E               
Tabakov, E                   
Tansman, A                   
Tower, J                     
Verbesselt, A               
Volkov, K                   
Wiener, J           
Woestijne, D van de         
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Delicious Manager on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:16
One more:

1954: Alexander Tansman

There are also these AFTER 1981:

1982: John McCabe
1983: Edward Gregson
1986: Alun Hoddinott
1987: Steven Stucky
1988: Rodion Shchedrin No 3 (Old Russian Circus Music)
1989: Rodion Shchedrin No 4 (Khorovody)
1991: Joan Tower
1994: Robin Holloway No 3
1996: Gerard Schurmann
1998: Rodion Shchedrin No 5 (Four Russian Songs)
2002: Jennifer Higdon
2003: Stanisław Skrowaczewski
2005: Robin Holloway No 4
2009: Robin Holloway No 5
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:22
Hrm. If the Slonimsky work you're referring to is "Concerto for Orchestra, three electric guitars and solo instruments" then it may not count by the standards here :) (but it is pre-1981 at least! )
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:24
The von Einem is from 1943 and the Tansman is from 1954: so they both qualify ;D

The Gregson dates from 1983, Hoddinott from 1986, the McCabe from 1982 and the Schurmann from 1996.

The Tower was composed in 1991 and the Higdon in 2002. Strictly speaking, the Benjamin Lees is a "Concerto for Chamber Orchestra".

The others I don't know about off-hand.

You may see why I imposed my cut-off of 20 years ago ;D A lot more Concertos for Orchestra have been composed in the last two decades.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:37
So......

relating these to countries ;D ;D...

The first Concerto for Orchestra wriiten by a composer from a particular country would be:

Austria:              von Einem(1943)
Czech Republic:  Kalabis(1966)
Denmark:            Bentzon(1963)
Germany:            Hindemith(1925)
Hungary:             Kodaly(1939)
Italy:                   Malipiero(1931) ('Concerti')
Norway:              Baden(1968)
Poland:               Szeligowski(1930)
Russia:                Starokadomsky(1937)
Switzerland:        Beck(1928) ('Symphony No.4')
United Kingdom: Tippett(1963)
U.S.A.:                 Piston(1933)


(As Amended)

Can't find a Dutch, Finnish, French, or Swedish example.

Was Tippett really the first British composer to write a Concerto for Orchestra??
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:41
I take it you're not counting the Vuataz because of the modifier :), likewise the Roussel... as to Swedish composers, Rolf Martinsson's quite recent Concerto for Orchestra (only a few years old, that piece) counts, of course, and is being played in recent concerts. Though I would think there's an earlier one.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:46
Quote from: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:41
I take it you're not counting the Vuataz because of the modifier :), likewise the Roussel...

I know this a (slightly) silly exercise ;D ;D but I was taking it in the sense of a "Concerto for Orchestra"-strictly defined-which aimed to exploit the roles of the different sections of a full orchestra, a la Bartok. I am, of course, well aware that different composers have interpreted the title in completely different ways :)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:48
so how did Vuataz interpret it? I don't even know his piece. I've seen recordings of his mentioned for quite some time but don't think I've heard his music yet. Erland von Koch's similarly named Konsert for liten Orkester likewise (I've only heard a few pieces of his but not that one)- similar name, but doesn't necessarily imply similar approach to Roussel or to Bartók- one needs to know the piece before deciding. I think I may have Roussel's or have access to it and will get back to you... (the title is different and based on that one can delete it; I have no trouble following that rule.)

And speaking for myself only anyway I have no trouble at all with silly or slightly silly exercises, and fill up a lot of time with such lists. Sometimes very interesting things fall out of them all the same. But at least we can count the Martinsson ;) (while looking for an earlier Swede.)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 15:57
Finnish: Mikko Heiniö (b.1948), 1982, opus 40. (not necessarily the earliest one, again, but take this one and work back :) )
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Callipygian on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:11
Stepan Degtiarev - Concert for orchestra (late 18th century, can't find exact year)
Enrique Llácer 'Regolí' - Concierto para orquesta Op. 25 - Welleriana (1960s?)

Post-1981: Menachem Zur - Concert for Orchestra - 2001
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: albion on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:20
I think we should include *****'s exhilarating ***** and possibly the ***** as well.

:-X

Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:33
Danish: Niels Viggo Bentzon's opus 148 Concerto for Orchestra (1963) predates the Koppel.
Albion- note first post :) "Concerto for orchestra" and translated terms only in this thread... otherwise would have argued very strongly for Holmboe's "8th concerto" (which definitely is a concerto for orchestra as usually understood, despite the name "Sinfonia concertante"- sinfonia concertante for whom? :) The string section gets a solo in one of the 2nd movement variations, but so do the brass (with percussion.), and besides... :) ).
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: albion on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:43
Quote from: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:33Albion- note first post :) "Concerto for orchestra" and translated terms only in this thread

Duly noted and expunged.

;)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: alberto on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:45
The right title of Malipiero 1931 work is "Concerti" (plural) for orchestra. I heard just once in an actual concert. Anyway it keeps rigthly its place in this thread.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:47
also: Swiss: Conrad Beck Symphony 4 "Konzert für Orchester" (1928). That counts, I do think. (Well, arguable, but I'll argue it? :) Admittedly it's earlyish.)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 17:05
Thanks for all this information :)

Bentzon certainly replaces Koppel. Conrad Beck gets the honour for the Swiss. Malipiero keeps at the top of the Italian list pro tem ;D ;D
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Rainolf on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 22:43
Heinrich Kaminski's Concerto grosso for double orchestra predates Hindemith's work, it's from 1923. So Kaminski would be the first German, who composed an orchestra concerto.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 22:44
if we're counting concerti grossi (which aren't the same as concertos for orchestra even in definition- they divide the orchestra into a ripieno and a concertino section, which is not how a "concerto for orchestra" is conceived generally, which is a work in which the orchestra is all soloists at various times, more or less; this would not apply to the ripieno section of a Concerto Grosso, which is basically a concerto with a large section of soloists, a predecessor of the modern concerto for soloist(s) and orchestra (itself also an instrumental outgrowth of the vocal Baroque aria, but that's a related but other tale), that would probably be someone about four centuries before. Therefore the first post of the thread is still important...
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Rainolf on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 23:39
Yes, the definition is the problem with Kaminski's Concerto. He said, that he chosed the title to avoid the term "symphony". In fact, there is no division between Ripieno and Concertino there, but between two seperate orchestras. But they aren't used as contrasting groups. He combines the individual voices from the two orchestras in many different ways. So this work couln't be described as a Concerto grosso in the baroque definition. But is isn't realy a Concerto for Orchestra in the sense of eg. Bartok's work. (NB: It's a pity that there is no commercial recording of Kaminski's orchestral works, he was a genius!)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 23:52
Have seen a few of Kaminski's works (besides the string quintet and quartet) (and of Hans Koessler's, another name that comes to mind at the same time) - am certainly very curious...
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: albion on Thursday 13 October 2011, 18:10
Quote from: Albion on Tuesday 11 October 2011, 16:20
I think we should include *****'s exhilarating ***** and possibly the ***** as well.

:-X



Disregarding the rules of the thread, I can contain myself no longer - and heartily recommend Malcolm Arnold's Philharmonic Concerto (1976) and Concerto for 28 Players (1970).

;)
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Dundonnell on Thursday 13 October 2011, 19:46
I have absolutely no issue with you recommending these two works by Malcolm Arnold :)

The whole topic is fraught with difficulty regarding nomenclature ;D
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: alberto on Sunday 16 October 2011, 17:49
In1940 Bruno Bettinelli (1913-2004) composed a Concerto for orchestra in three movements.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: JollyRoger on Friday 27 January 2012, 06:43
Quote from: alberto on Sunday 16 October 2011, 17:49
In1940 Bruno Bettinelli (1913-2004) composed a Concerto for orchestra in three movements.
IMHO, Bettinelli is a grand voice, unjustly ignored and unknown by most folks..
Unfortunately most of his music suffers from poor audio as it predates better technology, re-recording his music would be a godsend..
Is there any posted here at unsung?
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: eschiss1 on Saturday 28 January 2012, 02:06
The only Bettinelli works I've heard, I think, have already come out on CD, so can't help here. (He's actually been fairly well-served on CDs if one counts smaller labels, e.g. his 4th concerto for orchestra on a 1991 Ricordi (publisher) CD; his sinfonia breve conducted by Bernstein reissued on a 1991 (again) Ricordi CD ; a Naxos (Italian Naxos maybe?) 2011 guitar CD ; Missa brevis on Sarx on 2001 , other choral works on Sarx...
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Paulp on Monday 27 February 2012, 00:01
A few additions to the list:
Paul Patterson has done 2 Concertos for Orchestra, no.1 in 1981, and no.2 in 2000
Steven Stucky has done a Second Concerto for Orchestra in 2003 (A Pulitzer Prize winner, I believe)
Arnold Cooke did one in 1986
The 10th and last of Maxwell Davies' Strathclyde Concertos is for orchestra alone, if I remember correctly.
Gunther Schuller has done 3 Concertos for orchestra to date (the 3rd, "Farbenspiel" [1987] was recorded in Louisville)
Skrowaczewski also did one not too long ago.
And I gather Christopher Rouse has done one just a couple of years back.
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: rbert12 on Thursday 01 March 2012, 12:34
Some more from my collection, pre-1981:

Raymond Chevreuille 1947 (¿first belgian?)
Alan Hovhannes (at least 8 concertos for orchestra, from 1951, as I have records from 1, 7 and 8)
Yorgo Sicilianos 1961 (¿First greek?)
Sophie-Carmen Eckhard-Gramatté 1961 (¿First canadian?)
Antón García Abril 1972 Concerto for Orchestra Hemeroscopium (Sorry, its against the rules but I wanted to add one from Spain)
Julien-François Zbinden 1977
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: Christo on Saturday 16 June 2012, 09:01
Yes, I found two Dutch additions to the catalogue:

1959 Hans Kox, Concerto pour orchestre - possibly the first CfO in the Netherlands then
1982 Henk Badings, Concerto for orchestra

... and a third one:

1960 Berend Giltay, Concerto per orchestra
Title: Re: Concertos for Orchestra
Post by: reiger on Saturday 16 June 2012, 13:25
Marc Neikrug's Concerto for Orchestra had its world premiere by the New York Philharmonic in April 2012.