Promised by Naxos for mid-March release is the first of three CDs of Raff's piano music. The soloist is British-Vietnamese pianist Tra Nguyen, who made such an impression a couple of years ago with her performances for Sterling of Raff's Concertante Die Tageszeiten and his Suite for Piano and Orchestra. The works which will be on this CD are the Fantaisie WoO.15A, the set of twelve Frühlingsboten op.55 and the Drei Kalvier-soli op.74. Having heard a preview of the recording I can say that her interpretations and technique are all that one could wish for in these première recordings, but don't take my word for it - here's a YouTube promotional video (http://youtu.be/IiC_PIk7Fo4) with Tra playing the seventh of the Frühlingsboten set.
Wow, this is something to look forward to.
Indeed. Great stuff...
Nice indeed.
A little more information (http://www.naxos.com/ecard/grandpiano/gp602/)...
Remarkable sleeve design but definitely a must-buy.
I think the packaging is rather striking myself. I see that the other three CDs which launch this new label from Naxos are piano music by Saint-Saëns, Schulhoff and Weinberg.
The sleeve design is indeed quite striking - but I really couldn't care less about it. It's the MUSIC that's important - and for me the CD is a definite MUST BUY.
I really can't wait to get this! I'm a bit amazed that this hasn't been done before. What I've heard of Raff's solo piano music - and his writing for the piano in songs - is some of the most sublime keyboard music I've ever come across. Just listening to the piano part for Op.172#9 Nach der Geburt ihres Sohnes, for instance, or the opening minute and five seconds or so of his Op.14 Piano Sonata... and that's to say nothing of how he handles the piano with orchestra.
By the way, has his Suite for Piano & Orchestra, Op.200 ever hit commercial recording? The 2nd movement of that also contains some of the most gorgeous piano-involved passages known to me.
Sorry to get a bit off-topic, but what I meant to say was that I'm tremendously excited. I've yet to hear a piece by Raff that I thought was less than good, and I know there will be works on these discs that I've never heard. Let's see if his perfect record with my ears continues! Based on past experience, I'm optimistic!
Josh, the Suite for Piano & Orchestra was issued by Sterling (http://www.sterlingcd.com/catalogue/cds1085.html) in 2009 with Tra as soloist, as she is in Die Tageszeiten (http://www.sterlingcd.com/catalogue/cds1089.html), a piano concerto - cum - choral symphony which Sterling issued in 2010.
This is also a must buy for me.
The Saint-saens sounds good too - wonder if it will be complete (unlike the so called complete set on Vox which annoyingly misses out all of the self transcriptions which I would really like to hear, as well as various other odds and ends).
Well, 5 years after the launch of Taneyev's complet quartets vol 1 on Naxos, we're still on vol 2, so don't get too exited.
Not quite as bleak as that, Erato! I recall Vol 1 of the Carpe Dieum recordings came out in January 2008, and Vol 2 in Feb 2011. But I agree that's quite a gap between Vols 1 and 2........and at such a rate we'll all be white-haired toothless old men by the time we get to Vol 5.
(In the meantime there is the very good series - on five CDs - of the Taneyev Quartet performances on Northern Flowers).
I've still got rather a smile on my face that has persisted ever since Mark's post about Vol 1 of Raff being released in March. Whatever the world might happen to think, here we have a major composer. And, as far as I know, these piano works have never before received recordings. And, to make it even more of an event to truly celebrate, these premiere recordings are being released on an easily accessible budget priced label. What could be better than that?!!!!!!
All four initial releases looks like purchases to me.
Quote from: Jonathan on Thursday 19 January 2012, 18:48
The Saint-saens sounds good too - wonder if it will be complete (unlike the so called complete set on Vox which annoyingly misses out all of the self transcriptions which I would really like to hear, as well as various other odds and ends).
That set on Vox is hidious. Some of the tracks are in mono -- recorded in the 1970s. The four hand pieces are all mixed in, and it has easily the worst version of Carnival of the Animals I've ever heard.
It's really about time someone corrects the lack of Saint-Saens piano music, as there's only one actually good disc of it in existence, the etudes on Hyperion...and disappointingly the first disc will be that too. Yeesh.
Back to Raff, I hope the sound quality is better than that video....there's something really off about it.
The second volume of the Raff series is scheduled for release later this year and the third and final volume will come out early in 2013. I understand that the second volume of the Saint-Saëns and the next two volumes of the Weinberg series will be issued this year too. Incidentally I calculated that the "complete Raff piano music" would need about 45 CDs! Not as many as the 99 onto which Hyperion fitted Liszt's, but still too daunting a prospect to be realistic.
I'm not sure if Grand Piano is going to be a budget label, actually. It looks more like a mid or full price offering to me.
As for the quality of the sound, TerraEpon, I've heard the final mixes of the first two Raff CDs and the audio quality is exemplary. Obviously, the promotional video was made for display on YouTube at a later date than the CD recording sessions, which were at the superb Nimbus facility near Monmouth.
are there ... hrm, painful phrase construction- I should say not known but suspected (well, known, even) - to be as many unknown Raff piano works as was the case for Liszt? Well, maybe not as many, but - I recall all those considerations that led Howard to anticipate, in an interview about his project (again in Fanfare magazine, I'll try to look up the date- I have the issue somewhere I think... - I don't have that many issues anymore left from my subscription and none in good shape from all the rereading :D ) well in advance that there would have to be - as there have indeed been already - several supplementary volumes - and they are not the end of the affair of course.
I hope to be able eventually to buy (download legally) a number of the 45ish-plus CDs (hopefully improved circumstances will allow) but also hope that a number of radio stations around the globe (e.g. Austria's fine Radio Stephansdom, which often plays Raff works; Concertzender Hilversum has broadcast quite a few too) will continue to thrive and webcast and will do so...
Let's start with that wonderful (and perfectly logical) Rumsfeld quote:
QuoteThere are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.
To answer your question, Eric, the "known knowns" are works from the 1840s and 50s which are known to have been written but which we know were subsequently destroyed (in most cases) or lost - 17 works comprising 32 numbers. The "known unknowns" are the piano pieces from the same period which are mentioned in letters or other documents but for which no evidence of their actual composition, performance or destruction exists so they are assumed, but can't be proved, never to have been written - 8 works comprising 17 numbers at the last count. One of these from 1849 came to light last year, a manuscript of an Etude on Bellini's
I Puritani which was found in a sheaf of Liszt organ music manuscripts in The Hague. Finally, there must of course be the "Unknown unknowns", and into that category neatly falls (or rather, fell) the rather fetching
Fantaisie recorded on the first CD, which was found with the Bellini piece and about which nothing had been known before its discovery.
My estimate of 45 CDs includes all the works known to be still extant and includes Raff's four hands transcriptions of his own orchestral and chamber compositions and his transcriptions, fantasies and arrangements of the works of other composers. FWIW, it's a deliberately conservative estimate - Raff isn't a composer known for his brevity...
Every time a new Raff CD is going to be released it's nothing less than an exciting happening. It doesn't matter what genre it is. At least, this is the way I feel it. For me it proves again that Raff is very much more than just one of the many unjustified unsung composers. Raff's place is with the sungs, as I may say so (I know another composer who also belongs there, indeed, whose name also begins with an R ;)).
I guess Ries?
Quote from: eschiss1 on Friday 20 January 2012, 14:56
...as there have indeed been already - several supplementary volumes - and they are not the end of the affair of course.
Hi eschiss1,
Sadly, Leslie Howard has said barring any major discoveries, the Liszt project is complete. I think that's a real shame but I suppose you can't go on searching for ever (there is a list of missing works that was published in the Liszt Society Journal (UK) some years ago - it includes quintets and lots of chamber music, I assume this will never come to light due to the length of time elapsed)
Back to Raff piano music on Naxos; I have a problem with Naxos sometimes (I'm certain I've said this here before, maybe even recently) in that they start a series and then it stops, dead (e.g. Dohnanyi and Tchaikovsky, to name but two). At least in this case, the CDs are due out fairly soon after the inception of the project. I'm looking forward to all 3 of them already and the Saint-saens which I will buy despite having the Hyperion one which, agreeing with TerraEpon, is an excellent disc too (and the Vox
is awful...)
Quote from: Peter1953 on Friday 20 January 2012, 16:42
Every time a new Raff CD is going to be released it's nothing less than an exciting happening. It doesn't matter what genre it is. At least, this is the way I feel it. For me it proves again that Raff is very much more than just one of the many unjustified unsung composers. Raff's place is with the sungs, as I may say so (I know another composer who also belongs there, indeed, whose name also begins with an R ;)).
OK, I'm in. Rubinstein or Rufinatscha?
Well, I want to know what the statement means (actually, about time I should ask, after awhile on this forum- "sung", "should be sung"- maybe it's a reference to especially bel canto vocal music only and I didn't know... :^) ) I was going to guess at the answer too but then it occurred to me that I was guessing at the answer to a different question.
re: Liszt
Of course one has to consider the sheer number of pieces are are recorded two/three/four times, sometimes with only minor changes (often times the only difference is the coda, or more commonly one playing the normal version and the other playing the ossia). IIRC it was originally estimated at something like 54 (!) discs.
Of course, outside of one piece (for some bizzare reason), none of Liszt's 4 hand music was included (if you're comparing to Raff's 45 CD estimate). Known how much of THAT there is, I'd wager another 30 discs at least could come of someone giving a recording project for it a go...
I know, it's such a shame it's not all been recorded but I've made suggestions to someone about recording the complete Liszt 4 hand and 2 piano works but have yet to have a definitive response. I will of course keep you posted if I hear anything...
Well Naxos seems to be including some in their complete Liszt, though of course being Naxos they are taking forever anyway (and probably not including much of the alternate stuff on the flip side)
MDT are now advertising the CD for pre-order...
http://www.mdt.co.uk/MDTSite/product//GP602.htm (http://www.mdt.co.uk/MDTSite/product//GP602.htm)
...the release date is 27th February.
Thanks, Alan.
Huh. So it's not actually Naxos then, per se. It's full price (thus even less incentive to buy the Vol. 1 of Saint-Saens, despite the whole "well if you support it it'll mean there's interest and it'll continue" factor).
"You pays your money and you takes your choice". Nobody is forced to buy CDs. Naxos have done market research and have concluded that there is a market for a premium piano brand offering premium performances and audio quality. I haven't heard the Saint-Saens, but that's certainly true of the Raff recording.
Shucks! It is either: go without, or incur a debt.
What the hell. Clear as daylight - the choice already made!!! I've looked forward so much to this, and the experience of hearing others exclaiming about it is something I could not easily endure.
Quote from: TerraEpon on Wednesday 01 February 2012, 17:58
Huh. So it's not actually Naxos then, per se. It's full price
...which I, for one, am willing to pay.
hopefully some of it will be on a radio station meanwhile and soon, but I do intend to get the CDs / a download via iTunes or another such websites, as and when I can.
Meanwhile, very glad (needless to say?) that such recordings (presumably so well played) are now available...
For the sake of a fellow's pocket, I draw attention to the fact that the disc is now on the HMV site at £8.99.
I have no connection whatsoever with HMV, apart from being an extremely satisfied and regular customer.
Peter senior, your post resulted in my first order from HMV. Shipment costs to the Netherlands £2.50. I thought, why not order a few other CD's more to make advantage of £2.50 per shipment, like MDT does ? But no. HMV asks £2.50 PER ordered CD to my country. Not so attractive. Never mind. I can hardly wait for the Raff CD to arrive.
I'm sorry to read, young Peter, that HMV charge you £2.50 per disc for postage to the Netherlands. Alas!
As you've doubtless read in the press the company are in a bad way financially, and it wouldn't surprise me if they suddenly collapse.
However their web-based business, HMV Guernsey Ltd, seems to be rather separate from the chain of shops in the UK. The former, I believe, is profitable, and the financial problems arise from lack of retail in their high street stores (many years ago the main store in London's Oxford Street was mecca, but now the remaining stores seem to me to be dreadful places populated by young men with rings in their noses, glazed eyes and who doubtless would complain about the serious lack of repeated heavy bass notes in Raff).
So I hope the on-line business is secure. If HMV does fold up, alas, there goes a source of very temptingly priced CDs. Which would be awful - if only because earlier today I placed orders for £97.00 of February / March new releases! But I feel safe enough, for company policy is to collect the money for an order at the time of dispatch.
Incidentally if, like many in this forum, you pursue those wonderful Dutton releases, do try HMV first. For at least the last year they've offered a 'pre-release price' of £5.99, and even now all of the last batch of releases can be found in 'special offers' at £4.99. Of course, you would have to add £2.50 per disc, but maybe that is still a significant reduction on prices elsewere. For those of us lucky or unlucky enough to live within the UK there is free postage.
Yes, the arrival of the first volume of the Raff piano music will be an event to celebrate. I think I've got hold of just about every Raff CD that there is, and regularly listen to them (but I'm sure Mark would quickly point to something I haven't yet encountered!). I've read about the piano compositions....but I don't believe I have ever actually listened to any of them apart from that Valentina Seferinova Cahoots CD. Absolutely wonderful composer, and I owe the introduction to his works through this forum.
But I gabble! May you have many happy hours with Raff (and Rontgen) and do be sure to make huge demands on the doctors!
Grumpy old Peter
What a wonderful composer Raff was. We (all) know it, but these excerpts (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Joachim-Raff-1822-1882-Klavierwerke-Vol-1/hnum/1999720) prove it once again.
Quote from: petershott@btinternet.com on Saturday 04 February 2012, 17:57
I'm sorry to read, young Peter, that HMV charge you £2.50 per disc for postage to the Netherlands. Alas!
They also don't deduct VAT for sales outside the EU, like other British webshops do. All in all, bargains have to be extremely good to make hmv.co.uk worth it.
Well, my copy arrived in the post on Thursday, I've only collected it this morning from the sorting office but I plan on listening to it later on!
Really looking forward to hearing it.
Not to sound negative, but the sound quality really doesn't sound all that good on the samples.
Hat's off, a winner!
Firstly, this is definitely a premium product - excellent piano sound (neither too close nor too distant and with a nice sense of the recording venue), superb playing, full and lucid booklet notes from our own Mark Thomas, and wonderful, unfamiliar repertoire. What more could one want?
I've only listened to some of the CD, but it's already enough to make this one of my CD highlights of 2012. As I write this, I am listening to the miracle that is Raff's Metamorphosen, the last of the Three Piano Solos, Op.74 (1852, but only published in 1859). This is highly attractive, but emphatically not easy music - it actually requires and repays careful listening.
As with Raff's symphonies, this first volume of piano recordings ought to bring about a substantial revision of Raff's reputation and his position in the history of music in the 19th century. More reactions in due course...
Thanks for the very positive initial response, Alan. Personally, I think this potentially one of the most important Raff CD release for quite some time because, whilst not the first CD of Raff piano music, it is the first such CD by a major label with significant distribution and promotional clout. All of which would count for nothing if the interpretations or audio quality were below par, but with Tra Nguyen as the soloist in recordings made by Michael Ponder at the famous Wyastone Concert Hall then they are top notch. I'll pass over the notes (but thanks for the "lucid") and we are left with the music, which should speak for itself.
Personally, I'm utterly delighted with the result, but I'm hardly unbiased so here's (http://www.naxos.com/reviews/reviewslist.asp?catalogueid=GP602&languageid=EN#72084) a more independent reaction to this and the other three initial Grand Piano CDs. Volume 2, is due out later in the year.
I've also spun the disc several times over the last few days and am very impressed, the works are interesting, varied and repay re-listening. Tra Nguyen is a superb pianist who makes an excellent advocate for these works and well up to the technical demands of the music which, in places sound considerable! I especially liked some of the smaller Frühlingsboten which are charming and amusing in places. As Mark said yesterday, the piano sound is very good too. I am already looking forward to the remaining volumes.
Only one thing, my copy appears to have the Three Soli as the first 3 tracks rather than before the Fantasie at the end. Anyone else noticed this (either that or my CD player is behaving very oddly...) ;D
Jonathan, the CD was initially pressed with the tracks in the wrong order and these pressings were withdrawn and replaced before despatch to retailers. It looks as if the copy you have is one of the wrongly pressed ones, though. I am assured by Naxos that they will replace any such copies. My advice is to email Grand Piano / Naxos customer service and ask for a replacement. If you have any problems with that then email me privately, please.
I too would like to say how wonderful the new CD is. Tra Nguyen is a superb pianist and her playing is indeed, as has been stated, powerful and poetic. She interprets all 3 pieces with great artistry, wonderfully powerful and dynamic one moment and then sublimely delicate the next. Listening to this CD, the 76 minutes duration seems to fly by all too quickly. Metamorphosen is indeed a marvelous work and the other two pieces Frühlingsboten and Fantaisie are superb in their own way also. All Raff admirers will love this CD. A must-buy in my opinion!(and not just for Raff admirers!)
cheers
Dennis
Quote from: Mark Thomas on Saturday 31 March 2012, 07:56
Jonathan, the CD was initially pressed with the tracks in the wrong order and these pressings were withdrawn and replaced before despatch to retailers. It looks as if the copy you have is one of the wrongly pressed ones, though. I am assured by Naxos that they will replace any such copies. My advice is to email Grand Piano / Naxos customer service and ask for a replacement. If you have any problems with that then email me privately, please.
Thanks Mark - I've emailed them and will let you know what happens (serves me right for using preorder...)
I can only second all the enthusiastic comments on this wonderful CD. As usual I am puzzled by the fact that Raff wasn't such a virtuoso on the piano, but several of these delightful pieces show some real pyrotechnics. A real winner. Also my compliments for the interesting and informative booklet notes, Mark!
And Jonathan, you have a possible collectors item! If it was a postage stamp with an error your future could be that of a very wealthy man...
Too late Peter1953, I sent it back this afternoon! Oh well, so much for retiring early ;D
I have at last found time to listen to this splendid CD - and I can honestly say that I have nothing but unqualified praise for every aspect of it: playing (quite masterly and completely in sympathy with the composer - or so it seems; what a sensitive pianist Tra is!), recording (very warm and truthful), presentation (simple and stylish), booklet notes (a model of their kind - clear and informative). Brilliant! 5 stars all round.
You deserve to be proud and very pleased, Mark.
I blush with pleasure. Thanks very much for everyone's plaudits.
Incidentally, I forgot to say that the Metamorphosen is a major work IMHO, which repays repeated hearings - Raff at his very best.
This is true - it's certainly a major piece but wait until you hear the Variations on an Original Theme which has centre-stage on volume 2! Coincidentally, I have just this afternoon received the first mix of volume 3 - the Album Lyrique is as varied, clever and downright attractive as volume 1's Harbingers of Spring, whilst the Cinq Eclogues are just meltingly gorgeous. But you'll have to wait about ten months for that CD I'm afraid.
Oh plangent anticipation! The glimmering shaft of cosmic esperance that steers my voyage through the atrabilious tempests which I must endure until the epiphany of its release! - as Chiam Farschele might have written. I shall just say: "I look forward to hearing both disks very much." It's awfully easy to write inflated drivel, isn't it?
Atrabilious? Is that a word? ??? ;D
Certainly is, Jim. Look it up.
The CD is the Album of the Week in UK's Independent daily newspaper today.
I understand that this release is consistently the highest seller of the Grand Piano releases so far, which is great news.
And jolly well deserved too.
I too love this CD. And was pleasantly surprised that the disc sounds better than I thought it would based on the video and the sound samples.
Likewise, especially now I have one with the correct tracks in the correct order!
The contents of volume 2 sound tempting, with the Fantaisie-sonate...
My review of vol.1 is now online here (http://www.raff.org/records/reviews/piano/12.htm).