OK, deep breath!
What in the view of forum members is the greatest violin concerto written in roughly the last fifty years?
My suggestion: George Rochberg (1974; restored original version 2001)
Reason: totally memorable; profoundly moving; beautiful in its neo-Romantic way. The violin really sings.
Excellent choice, Alan :)
I shall try to think of others ;D
I agree with Alan's description of Rochberg's VC, - a very plausible contender.
Right up there in my judgement would be Allan Pettersson's 2nd (1977).
I don't disagree, but mulling over the question I'm having difficulty in distinguishing between the post 1960 Vn Concerto I've most enjoyed and the one that I think might be the greatest. The first category doesn't quite cohere with the second.
But, tee hee, my initial response is to think that this Alan fellow is always entirely unpredictable! I guess we all build up a picture of another's likes and dislikes from comments made and views expressed. And now and again I think to myself I've got Alan reasonably well pinned down. But then along comes a comment such as the one on Rochberg and my assumptions get thrown and I reckon its author is an especially discriminating and sensitive listener. That's a bit of praise, Alan!
.....and well-deserved praise too :) :) Remember that it was the same Alan who recently requested Harrison Birtwistle's Violin Concerto ::) ;D
(Always helps to be complimentary to a site Administrator ;D ;D)
John Veale's.
I agree with Tapiola, John Veale is also my choice. Very romantic. What a most moving and wonderful 2nd movement (Lament: Largo), by the composer simply called love music. And that's true.
But I must make a confession: I don't know the Rochberg, which means I have to... investigate.
Maybe not the 'greatest; but I'm very fond of Fazil Say's Violin Concerto '1001 Nights in The Harem' (a recording of which is available in the DL section)
And then of course there's Corigliano.
Well, what responses!
Yes, I'd second the Veale as a contender - and now I must get to know the Corigliano. What's it like?
Und was sagst du, Tobias?
I'm no judge of 'greatness', but I do like Thomas Ades' concerto, as well as both of George Lloyd's, the one with wind orchestra, the other with string orchestra
In my opinion the greatest Violin Concerto of the last 50 years is, by far, the Sciostakovich second (1967): in my opinion, in absolute terms, one of the greatest works of the last fifty years.
I could list some contenders (between concertos not yet named, but just for a "silver medal":
- John Adams Concerto (1993) (no longer minimalist)
- Philip Glass n.1 (1987)
- Peter Maxwell Davies n.1
-Henri Dutilleux "L'arbre des songes" (1985)
Quote from: Alan Howe on Sunday 08 April 2012, 08:58
Und was sagst du, Tobias?
There are many, many great violin concertos, so I checked my archive and found out that I have to choose 1 from more than 2000 works (let alone those works I don't have a recording of and so cannot decide how good they are). Honestly this decision is a bit too heavy for me on a Easter sunday morning. And in fact it depends much on the mood and the style I am looking for in a specific moment.
Best,
Tobias
Here is another vote for Fazil Say's Violin Concerto with Peteris Vasks' a close second.
I had to check out the date but I would go for the lone concerto [1964] of the German composer Ernst Hermann Meyer. It occupies a place somewhere near where Berg and Shostakovitch intersect, and there was a fine recording of it on the East German Eterna label with David Oistrakh.
Given the plural, I'd also put in a word for the lone concerto by Argentina's Alberto Ginastera.
And for the one I'd most like to hear, because I have never heard it, the late second concerto by Malipiero. I'm sure it might not make into this company though.
A friend once suggested that while the 19th century was an era of great piano concerti the 20th was one of great violin concerti.
In response to a couple of nominations above:
- Adams' violin concerto - it's fine, though I prefer his electric violin concerto "The Dharma at Big Sur" for its sheer high-spirited bonkersness. In the film "32 Short Films About Glenn Gould", there's a bit where Gould describes himself as an ecstatic loon. It's a phrase that comes to mind whenever I hear "Dharma".
- Corigliano's violin concerto - it's okay. The opening movement, "The Red Violin Chaconne", was a stand-alone piece that Corigliano made from his oscar-winning score to "The Red Violin" (coincidentally by the same director as "32 Short Films About Glenn Gould"!). That chaconne is a remarkable piece of work, I think. The rest of the concerto was tacked on some years later, and doesn't really do justice to the opening movement, for my money.
- Pettersson's 2nd violin concerto - yes yes yes
A couple of my own favourites to add to the list, then...
Feldman - Violin and Orchestra
Hillborg - Violin Conceto
Lutoslawski - Chain II
Matthews (Colin, that is) - Violin Concerto
My vote - Lionel Sainsbury's VC.
Quote from: violinconcerto on Sunday 08 April 2012, 09:54
Quote from: Alan Howe on Sunday 08 April 2012, 08:58
Und was sagst du, Tobias?
There are many, many great violin concertos, so I checked my archive and found out that I have to choose 1 from more than 2000 works (let alone those works I don't have a recording of and so cannot decide how good they are). Honestly this decision is a bit too heavy for me on a Easter sunday morning. And in fact it depends much on the mood and the style I am looking for in a specific moment.
Best,
Tobias
I'll take any suggestions - perhaps those which come to mind most readily...
Quote from: fr8nks on Sunday 08 April 2012, 12:34
Here is another vote for Fazil Say's Violin Concerto with Peteris Vasks' a close second.
Don't know Fazil Say's VC, but Pēteris Vasks' 1997 concerto 'Tālā gaisma' (Distant Light) is one of my candidates too. Another one is Otar Taktakishvili's Concerto No. 2 for Violin and Chamber Orchestra from 1987.
I'll answer for Tobias (who introduced me to this piece over a decade ago) with my own second choice, - Violin Concerto No.1 by Gerhard Rosenfeld (1963). Anyone else know it?
I am surprised to see my favourite 20th century VC has already been named: like shamokin88, I would take Ernst Hermann Meyer's great, passionate Violin Concerto from 1963/64. It's an impressive piece reflecting the inevitability of death, but at the same time it's a strong affirmation of life. A deeply tragical piece full of power and struggle, with slow outer movements and an impressive allegro in the centre.
While Meyer is almost forgotten today (clearly due to political reasons - he was a devoted communist who was active in GDR politics), this concerto has really found its way to CD as part of a 2 CD set dedicated to Oistrach's 100th birthday:
http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/David-Oistrach-Violinkonzerte-100th-Anniversary-Edition/hnum/4884402 (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/David-Oistrach-Violinkonzerte-100th-Anniversary-Edition/hnum/4884402)
Don't give too much on the liner notes, the writer is obviously unable to distinguish between Meyer as a person and his music and totally underestimates the concerto in a statement full of prejudices.
And yes, I also know Gerhard Rosenfeld's Violin Concerto No. 1 - a very fine piece with lots of energy in it.
I'm with Holger concerning E.H. Meyer's VC, and feel comfortable nominating this and the aforementioned Rosenfeld as my two foremost German entries among the candadites.
I'd love to hear the Meyer. But the Oistrakh set is loaded down with Bach and Vivaldi, which I am loathe to purchase yet again, and the only alternative seems to be the giant Kegel set. I've not been successful tracking down a concert performance.
Penderecki's Violin Concerto No.1.
This impassioned, tragic work has tons of intensity and was so important in marking the composer's transition from the avant-garde works he had written previously to his more 'romantically-inclined' later music. When it was premiered by Isaac Stern in 1977 the critics were appalled at what they regarded as Penderecki's 'treason' in moving back towards a more traditional idiom. A substantial number have never forgiven him to this day. Arnold Whittall who seems to review all new cd releases of Penderecki's music for the 'Gramophone' continues to heap obloquy on the composer's head.
The First Violin Concerto is a transitional work. The full glory of Penderecki's transformation (or evolution as he would prefer to regard it) can be heard in the Brucknerian Second Symphony of 1980 but that makes the Violin Concerto an even more important work for that reason.
Also, since it says "since 1960", Khachaturian's Violin Concerto-Rhapsody just squeezes in there being from 1961. And Shostakovich's 2nd is from 1967.
Perhaps not really within the spirit of the topic, and both composers have their earlier efforts being much more famous and better examples of the genre, but it's worth mentioning.
And I suugest listening to rather unknown piece by Polish Zbigniew Bargielski (1937).
His VC dates from 1975 and was dedicated to and premiered in January 1978 by Wanda Wiłkomirska.
It is very emotional piece of music. The violin part is lyricall while the orchestral part quite brutal.
The concerto is (was) available in the Polish Radio box with Bargielski's music - PRCD 080, studio recording.
I do have also off radio recording of that performance.
Concerto was also registered on LP as a part of the sound chronicle of the Warsaw Autumn Festival of Polish Music of 1978.
Besides one or the other (or both) of Penderecki's Concerti, another Polish VC in the running would be Aleksander Lason's terrific "Concerto Festivo" (1995).
I don't know the Bargielski work Marek refers to, but (ahem) think his BC recording might qualify for an upload.
I don't know about "greatest", but at the Ojai Festival a few years back, they performed the VC of Oliver Knussen. I was pretty impressed with it.
Quote from: markniew on Sunday 08 April 2012, 21:19
And I suugest listening to rather unknown piece by Polish Zbigniew Bargielski (1937).
His VC dates from 1978 and was dedicated to and premiered in January 1978 by Wanda Wiłkomirska.
It is very emotional piece of music. The violin part is lyricall while the orchestral part quite brutal.
The concerto is (was) available in the Polish Radio box with Bargielski's music - PRCD 080, studio recording.
I do have also off radio recording of that performance.
Concerto was also registered on LP as a part of the sound chronicle of the Warsaw Autumn Festival of Polish Music of 1978.
The Bargielski Violin Concerto and other works can be heard here:
http://chomikuj.pl/tadeusz_baird/2.+Muzyka
Quote from: JimL on Monday 09 April 2012, 01:28
I don't know about "greatest", but at the Ojai Festival a few years back, they performed the VC of Oliver Knussen. I was pretty impressed with it.
Knussen's conducting it, with Leila Josefowicz fiddling (and inevitably gurning away to her usual extremes!), at London's Barbican early next year.
Is gurning a good thing or a bad thing? :)
Quote from: JimL on Monday 09 April 2012, 16:27
Is gurning a good thing or a bad thing? :)
It's fine on radio ;), but it's rather off-putting "live".
I saw Knussen and Josefowicz give the world premiere of the Colin Matthews concerto I mentioned upthread. Honestly, the ridiculously extreme facial contortions Ms Josefowicz went through were frankly bizarre, though thankfully the piece was strong enough to hold the attention in spite of her! (though she's a bloomin' fine musician)
You know, now that you mention it, the performing affectations of soloists (and some conductors) might be worth a thread of its own. Sometimes the physical gestures, hand waving, grimaces and other contortions of violinists, pianists and cellists can be quite comically at odds with the sounds they produce, which can indeed be quite off-putting.
For those interested in hearing the VC by Bargielski - link available in the Downloads/Polish Music
For me, the greatest violin concertos since 1960 are:
William Bergsma
Corigliano
Dutilleux - L'arbre ses songes
Gubaidulina - Offertorium
Lutosławski - Chain 2
Nicholas Maw
Rochberg
Ruders No 2
Shostakovich No 2
Tishchenko No 2
Thanks: a list containing works I already have (Maw, Rochberg, Shostakovich 2, Dutilleux), works I'm unfamiliar with but think I might like (Corigliano, Tishchenko 2) and others which scare me to death (the rest). Can anybody re-assure me that my ears are going to be safe if I investigate them?
Gubaidulina's 'Offertorium' from 1980 I found a remarkable and profoundly moving work. I think it was the first Gubaidulina work I heard (in the Gidon Kremer, Boston SO / Dutoit recording on DG) and I've been hooked on her compositions ever since. Deeply impressive stuff.
I also direct your ears to her 'In tempus praesens: Violin Concerto' from 2007. I have two recordings (Mutter / Gergiev on DG and Gluzman / Nott on BIS), and consider there's little between them.
And if you want more Gubaidulina try 'The Lyre of Orpheus' (2006) for Violin, Percussion and String Orchestra.
Your ears, Alan, are quite safe with Gubaidulina, and listening to her stuff won't unsettle the enjoyment of Reinecke! But I'm not too sure about Tishchenko 2. Much of Tishchenko is unceasingly relentless and pretty strident, and if it does have a capacity to scare a listener to death then I think I'd regret going to meet my maker with Tishchenko still ringing in my ears.
Thanks, Peter.
How about these pieces by Norgard?
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2012/Apr12/Norgard_BISCD1872.htm (http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2012/Apr12/Norgard_BISCD1872.htm)
Well, I hate to disagree ;D but I would take Tishchenko any day of the week in preference to either Gubaidulina or Norgard ::)
Yes, Tishchenko is usually grim and relentless but in his fine Violin Concerto No.2 I can still hear the influence of his teacher Shostakovich. Indeed, the criticism of early and mid-period Tishchenko was that he was too much of a Shostakovich epigone. Gubaidulina and Norgard, on the other hand, are too near to Webernian expressionism for my tastes. I find the latter in particular almost unlistenable to.....and I say that as someone who admires a lot of mid to late 20th century music. I have given Norgard a fair try-on the repeated insistence by his fans (and there ARE many of them) that he is a great composer-but I just don't get him :(
The Norgard 2nd Violin Concerto can be heard in its entirety on You Tube. If you like what you hear then you have more advanced tastes than I do ;D ;D
Very interesting. I would very much agree with Colin that for me, Tishchenko is much more interesting and also accessible than Gubaidulina. Basically, Tishchenko is a composer whose musical language still works with tonal centres, and if compared to Gubaidulina he is definitely the one who is more rooted in tradition! His music certainly doesn't hide Shostakovich was his teacher, but in my view there is always a strong own voice, for instance regarding a certain architecture of his works. Honestly, two years ago when he was still alive he was my personal favourite for the greatest living symphonist. His Violin Concerto No. 2 is an excellent piece. It can even be found on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVqk2Xxox3A
Thanks for these pointers, gentlemen. I obviously have some youtubing to do!
The Bergsma won't do you any harm at all - in fact, it's fairly standard-issue, mid-twentieth-century conservative stuff, with no sharp edges to cut yourself on.
Too bad 1960 is the cutoff, or I'd throw Benjamin Lees excellent 1958 Violin Concerto into the ring. Great piece that should be heard as often as the Bartok, Stravinsky or Prokofiev concerti.
There is another Meyer, which we have positively discussed in an old thread and that is Edgar Meyer. Another previously discussed VC, like Edgar Meyer's, is composed by Lee Actor for the violinist Pip Clarke. Nice, lyrical and accessible VCs worth listening once in a while.
However, a thread on great VCs written since 1960 isn't IMHO "complete" without mentioning both delightful VCs (No. 1 in D minor, op. 50 and no. 2 in B minor, op. 100) by Thomas Schmidt-Kowalski, despite the fact that both works are not composed in a contemporary idiom but in a romantic style.
I'd say Dutton were onto something when recording Christopher Wright's incredibly beautiful new VC...
I utterly agree about the Wright: I listened again to it yesterday and was captivated!
Quote from: Jimfin on Saturday 14 April 2012, 13:40
I utterly agree about the Wright: I listened again to it yesterday and was captivated!
Is the Wright worth buying in view of its coupling with the RVW 5th Symphony ???
Absolutely 100%, yes! I hesitated at first, but am glad I succumbed!
Haven't "lived with" any violin concerto written since or in 1960 long enough to consider which I like best , on the one hand, or which I consider greatest (in some sense I don't blush at using - a more objective sense , a work that's both of high quality and, optimally, best of its time and innovative - influential perhaps, or potentially if better-known- eh, hush Eric...) -
different questions for me if not for everyone.
There's only a few in my collection (more symphonies and quartets written in that period there than violin concertos, I think, though I see I do have Margaret Sutherland's 1960 concerto, Ginastera's, Nordgren's 4th, one by Norgard I think, a couple by Lemeland, and van Hemel's fun 1968 2nd concerto ("four scherzandi with four instrumental groups") -(and a couple from here I haven't really listened to yet alas except for the Hoddinott Mistral which I enjoyed)... of concertos I'd love to have a recording of I count Vagn Holmboe's 3rd concerto...
hrm, you know - if you'd said "since 1950" on the third hand, I think me I'd have nominated Frank Martin's (1951) -
and not thought twice about, for first place. (Mildly innovative but to my ears best of its time and kind and a work that has only improved with acquaintance, like so much else by him- yes, I am being inconsistent...)
(With Benjamin Frankel's and Ivanovs' both of the same year given at least very high regard by me... sigh. Choices, choices, choices... better that than having none.)
Quote from: Peter1953 on Saturday 14 April 2012, 09:24
There is another Meyer, which we have positively discussed in an old thread and that is Edgar Meyer. Another previously discussed VC, like Edgar Meyer's, is composed by Lee Actor for the violinist Pip Clarke. Nice, lyrical and accessible VCs worth listening once in a while.
However, a thread on great VCs written since 1960 isn't IMHO "complete" without mentioning both delightful VCs (No. 1 in D minor, op. 50 and no. 2 in B minor, op. 100) by Thomas Schmidt-Kowalski, despite the fact that both works are not composed in a contemporary idiom but in a romantic style.
I addition to Edgar Meyer's VC (which is one of my favourites) there are several other great American VCs that could be mentioned here:
James Yannatos
Eric Ewazen
John Adams' "Dharma at Big Sur"
and from other countries
Matthew Hindson's "Australian Postcards"
Magnus Lindberg
H.Hallgrimsson's "Poemi"
G.v.Zieritz - Zigeunerkonzert (I'll going to post an LP transfer of this work later)
If you don't already know it, I would commend to your attention the violin concerto of Benjamin Lees. Technically, it is out of the running since it was written in 1958, but it received its first performance in 1963, and IMHO it is worth shoehorning into this thread.
There's a sympathetic review here http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/a/atk00042a.php (http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/a/atk00042a.php) of a recording that got a 2009 Grammy nomination.
Quote from: chill319 on Friday 20 April 2012, 07:40
If you don't already know it, I would commend to your attention the violin concerto of Benjamin Lees. Technically, it is out of the running since it was written in 1958, but it received its first performance in 1963, and IMHO it is worth shoehorning into this thread.
There's a sympathetic review here http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/a/atk00042a.php (http://www.classical.net/music/recs/reviews/a/atk00042a.php) of a recording that got a 2009 Grammy nomination.
Benjamin Lees' concerto is just great; one of my favorites.
Ross Edwards' 1988 Violin Concerto 'Maninyas'.