I read that Paavo Järvi has recorded Hans Rott's Symphony with the Frankfurt Radio Symphony Orchestra - certainly the highest-profile conductor to have tackled the work so far. A performance with this combination of conductor and orchestra is being broadcast on BBC Radio 3 tomorrow (Tuesday 26th) at 2.20 pm.
http://ionarts.blogspot.com/2010/04/paavo-jarvi-on-hans-rott.html (http://ionarts.blogspot.com/2010/04/paavo-jarvi-on-hans-rott.html)
http://www.weta.org/fmblog/?p=1938 (http://www.weta.org/fmblog/?p=1938)
Not to sound ungrateful, but do we really need this? What is this, the fourth or fifth recording? The Hyperion gave us all we needed to know, the CPO a nice bonus. There's so much other repertoire that is better, needs better recordings, and needs advocacy. How about the state of the art SACD (or BluRay) of Gliere 3? Oh well, I'm not the producer and I guess they know what they're doing. But how many recordings of a really obscure symphony can the market support?
Quote from: mbhaub on Tuesday 26 October 2010, 02:06How about the state of the art SACD (or BluRay) of Gliere 3?
There's one on Telarc, conducted by Bostein (sp?). Best recording of the work too (or at least, tied with Downes)
Quote from: mbhaub on Tuesday 26 October 2010, 02:06
Not to sound ungrateful, but do we really need this?
...more than another Bruckner or Mahler, less than a Marx-Herbstsinfonie...
Quote from: mbhaub on Tuesday 26 October 2010, 02:06
What is this, the fourth or fifth recording? The Hyperion gave us all we needed to know
Hyperion gave us what is propably the most uninteresting reading of the work ever. I'll be looking forward to Järvi - although I'm not getting my hopes up. But your last question is rather interesting; how many recordings of this can the market support? Especially since the 'hype' around this composer/work is sooo 20th century...
Well, the point is that we haven't had an absolutely superlative recording yet. Stop-gaps, yes; good recordings, yes; but nothing to blow your socks off. So I for one will be eagerly awaiting the RCA release - especially if it's as good as the radio recording I'm currently listening to, which is fabulous...
Listening to Paavo Järvi's radio performance again confirms my impression that this will be the recording to have when it eventually comes out. The orchestra plays superbly - with an intensity and belief in the piece that I've never heard before. Järvi's passionate advocacy is clearly audible - a no-apologies approach which, one hopes, may convince other conductors to take up the symphony.
I suppose what I'm asking is: shouldn't we want the very best for unsung music? Perhaps a really great performance of Rott's Symphony will reveal the stature of the piece such as we've never heard it before. I'm certainly hoping that this will be the case with Rufinatscha 6 when Chandos record it next month, good though the Austrian performance that we already have undoubtedly is.
Of course this recording will do both Hans Rott and the category unsung composers good. And still if Rott's symphony has been recorded before (and I can understand those who say that there are other works out there that deserves recording before this symphony gets recorded again!) the attention to the work from a conductor like Paavo Järvi surely will spread this music to new listeners. I think that the more famous the orchestra and conductor are, the more attention will a recording of a unsung work get among audience that tend to prefer standard repertoire.
Morten
I agree 100%, Morten.
I've just finished listening to this afternoon's BBC broadcast of Järvi's performance of the Rott Symphony and I must say that it has quite changed my view of what I had previously thought of as a rather overblown and over-hyped work. It's a bit limp of me not to be able to put my finger straight away on why it impressed me so, but I'm clearly going to have to sit down tomorrow and listen again! I was left , though, with the impression of a work of great stature given a blazing performance which satisfied both in the poetry of its delicate moments and in the vigour of its dramatic ones.
Paavo Järvi is a very, very fine conductor indeed and he has an orchestra which, under his direction, is becoming world-class. And he has clearly done his homework on Rott, particularly the Mahler connection. But most of all, he just believes in the symphony and goes for it. It's one of the most exciting performances of a relatively unknown piece of music that I have ever heard, knocking the previous best (IMHO, the very good Sebastian Weigle on Arte Nova) into the proverbial cocked hat. Mark has it spot-on: blazing!
Friends run together the question of (a) do we need it? - yes, of course we do, with the distinct question of (b) will the market support it? I don't know, but on the strength of comments above I shall certainly acquire the recording.
However what we do very much need is a widely accessible recording of the Rott string quartet. On the one occasion I heard it, the feet sure became departed from their socks.
Peter
Quote from: petershott@btinternet.com on Wednesday 27 October 2010, 00:34
However what we do very much need is a widely accessible recording of the Rott string quartet. On the one occasion I heard it, the feet sure became departed from their socks.
Peter
Describe, describe? (In some thread or other?) And who was performing? I know very little about Rott's surviving completed music (symphony, one other orchestral work I can think of... plus list of ...)
Eric
The String Quartet and a Symphony for String Orchestra in A flat have both been issued on an Acousence CD (ACO-CD 20205). Audio extracts at jpc here (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-Symphonie-As-Dur-f%FCr-Streichorchester/hnum/2181549).
ah. I notice re Rott the following worklist - http://www.hans-rott.de/werke/works.htm (http://www.hans-rott.de/werke/works.htm). Neat.
Quote from: Mark Thomas on Wednesday 27 October 2010, 07:55
The String Quartet and a Symphony for String Orchestra in A flat have both been issued on an Acousence CD (ACO-CD 20205). Audio extracts at jpc here (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-Symphonie-As-Dur-f%FCr-Streichorchester/hnum/2181549).
At a guess, the recorded string quartet is this (http://www.hans-rott.de/werke/sqcminor.htm) one?? *checks more closely :) * Oh- yes, it's linked to under -recordings (http://www.hans-rott.de/cde.htm)- no 'guess' needed. never mind :)
(Also, performed in New York City in September 2009 (http://www.jupitersymphony.com/Reviews.htm).)
Eric
Good to read those enthusiastic reviews of Rott's Symphony under Järvi. I've always felt sympathy for poor Rott as a person and his remarkable Symphony, in 1880 crushingly rebuffed by Brahms.
I'm very pleased with my Rott under Weigle. I ask myself, how frequently do I listen to this symphony? Maybe not even once a year. Therefore I'm not going to put Järvi's version on my wantlist, but I hope to listen to a broadcast in the near future.
I've given this a couple of good listens now, and I agree with the general positive attitude - with the exception of the last movement, particularly the 'Brahmsy' final two-thirds of it. Järvi takes this a breakneck speed and it appears to me that that takes away most of its charm and all of its elegiac character. Samuel's approach (whatever else one might think of his recording) is far more expansive, but these tunes demand for a certain amount of time and fluidum to develop. Not quite the definitive recording, then.
I have to disagree, Ilja. Järvi manages to keep together the sprawling structure of the finale in a way which is, to my ears (obviously!), thoroughly convincing. There's no such thing as a definitive recording, but Järvi's will be the closest yet. And he has the best orchestra so far!
While we're waiting for so long ... heard Paavo Järvi with Cincinnati SO (performed in February 2011) when this conductor took the symphony very fast – quarter of an hour quicker than the slowest-ever: Sergerstam in 1994 with Swedish RSO. It was well played with good coherence, rhythm, and momentum; superb in the brass fanfares, the ghost waltz and movement endings; and brought out the texture unusually clearly in the 3rd movement's short love theme. There is a tempo argument to be resolved in this work and whilst I haven't yet decided which side I'm on, Järvi certainly makes a persuasive case.
Incidentally, there's a Summer Workshop + evening informal performance (Bromley SO) at Legacy Hall, Beckenham on 10th June
The CD is being advertised as a forthcoming Japanese import by jpc...
http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-1858-1884-Symphonie-E-Dur/hnum/4916894 (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-1858-1884-Symphonie-E-Dur/hnum/4916894)
...but it is very expensive, so it'll be probably be worth waiting for its wider international release.
Having found the CD for sale at HMV in Japan, I've put in an order (it's not released until 9th May over there) at a bit of a premium over UK prices - but I couldn't wait for its wider release, so I hope I can report on it sometime soon...
And now jpc are advertising it as a June release...
http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-1858-1884-Symphonie-E-Dur/hnum/2571018?SESSIONID=14b4acb310a945e850299f20f7bd5e58 (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Hans-Rott-1858-1884-Symphonie-E-Dur/hnum/2571018?SESSIONID=14b4acb310a945e850299f20f7bd5e58)
Wow: this CD includes the world premiere (I don't think it's even yet reached any concert hall) of Rott's Suite in B flat major (1877, the year before both his wonderful Suite in E and starting his symphony). So this is the last of his recognised performable orchestral works to be recorded (well, 2 of the movements are performable). So, we have the Jarvi recording and a surprise bonus.
Well, for my money (and it cost me an arm and a leg to get it early from Japan!), this is the most dramatic account of Rott's fascinating work on the market. Coupled with world-class playing from the Frankfurt RSO under Paavo Järvi and recording quality to match, this is an immensely exciting release. Having said which, I'm now off to explore Segerstam's very different (and much slower) take on the piece. I suppose it's a bit like comparing, say, Kubelik and Maazel in Mahler 1: yer pays yer money...
By the way, this also seems to me the most Mahlerian account of the Symphony to have appeared. Of course, we know that P. Järvi regards Mahler's use of Rott's sound-world as virtual plagiarism:
<<I don't remember how I first came across this Symphony in E, but it was at a time when I was already receptive for Rott's mix of Wagner, Bruckner, and—so I would have thought—Mahler. It turns out that the 19 year old composer's audacious work, though heavily indebted to the first two composers as well as Brahms and Schumann, didn't copy anything from Mahler. Mahler copied from Rott, his fellow student-colleague. "In today's world", Paavo Järvi said to me earlier, "Mahler would be sued for plagiarism." (See interview on WETA.) Complete phrases, the treatment of the chorales—they are all there in Mahler's Second Symphony or the opening of the First Symphony's second movement. "You've got the Scherzo: daa Bum, baa Bum-da-dam, bum-da-da-da-dam... I mean, really!" Järvi is almost amused at the chutzpah Mahler displayed in lifting ideas from Rott.>>
http://ionarts.blogspot.com/2010/04/ionarts-at-large-paavo-jarvi-excites.html (http://ionarts.blogspot.com/2010/04/ionarts-at-large-paavo-jarvi-excites.html)
Well, Segerstam's is a very fine, but very different performance. I'd say it was more Brucknerian than Järvi (i.e. much more monumental), but nothing like as colourful or dynamic. If you want to hear how much Mahler there is in Rott (or vice versa!!), then Järvi's your man...